Silly question

Hi Hanne,

Language and grammar is so interesting and fun :-) I am always amazed at
how one language (English) can vary so greatly within and between countries.
When DH and I first were together we used to have arguments until we
discovered we were arguing about the same point of view; it was just that my
vocabulary was USA and his was NZ

If you ever do happen to spend some time 'south' give a yell, I can tell you
all the bestest places to live

Shona in NZ


"Hanne Gottliebsen" wrote in message
...
It's me again (yes I did wrongly write eg. earlier).

Let me quote from Fowler (IME preferred by K academics + the one retired
English teacher who proofread my PhD thesis):

About i.e.
quote on
It is naturally preceded by a stop; it should not be followed by a comma
unless the sense requires one, to introduce a parenthesis for instance.
[italics on] He attacked reactionaries, i.e. those whose opinions
differed from his own[italic of], but [italics on] He attacked
reationaries, i.e., it would seem, those whose opinions etc.
quote of

For scientific papers (all I see are computer science, mathematics and a
few medical ones) usually British scientists do not put the comma, US
ones do. I don't have enough experience of Southern Hemisphere English
of any kind to comment :-) Maybe I need to spend a couple of years
somewhere a lot further South next...

Also, I don't think I ever use i.e. (but sometimes e.g.) in
non-scientific writing. And certainly one sometimes see papers with
_way_ too many i.e.s in them.

Like I think I said early on: a Columbian colleague of mine in the US
and I had to just declare a truce on the issue. When rewieving
eachothers papers, I did not take out his commas after i.e. and he did
not my "missing" ones. We never did co-author - tha tmight have caused
some discussion :-)


Hanne
-who spent 30 min last night going through book boxes trying to find her
copy of Fowler.

Shona in NZ wrote:
I agree with you Jack that both can replaced easily with English word
('for
example' and 'that is') unfortunately i.e. and e.g. run rife in
scientific
writing due to limits on publication space; it takes up far less page
space
to put i.e. or e.g. :-S

On your other point, my formal scientific training took place here in NZ
and
the comma after the period is one of those rules that got fairly well
imprinted. In fact there are lecturers out there that have taken the
comma
after e.g. and i.e. to the height of being grammatical "pet peeve" and
will
mark off extra if it is omitted (ask me how I know :-)). Perhaps it is
a
scientific thing rather than a more mainstream thing?

Shona finding the i.e./e.g. thread very interesting in NZ

"bogus address" wrote in message
...

Near as I know there should always be a comma after e.g. (and i.e.
for that matter) no matter what the english language. I was taught
USA english and now use New Zealand/Australian (~British) english.

The way I do it: "e.g." and "i.e." MUST have the full stops (they're
abbreviations), and because a comma following a full stop looks silly
you NEVER put one after either.

But both are Latin expressions for things you can equally well say
in English so it's better not to use them in the first place.

Most of my education was in New Zealand and I think this approach
is the usual one there. You haven't forgotten your American usages
as much as you think you have.

Alluding to another OT thread: grew up in New Zealand, spent more
than half my life in Scotland, born in a country I hardly remember
despite my accent mostly being from there. My answer to "where are
you from?" is "is it compulsory to be from anywhere in particular?"


======== Email to "j-c" at this site; email to "bogus" will bounce

========

Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131

6604760

http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/purrhome.html food intolerance data &

recipes,

Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files and CD-ROMs of Scottish

music.

Hi Marissa,

I just sent a PDF copy to you. Let me know if you don't get it and I will
try again.

S in NZ

"Dr. Quilter" wrote in message
...
could you? no hurry, but I'd love to have a copy in my library for when
the doubts hit...

Shona in NZ wrote:

Hi Shona,

Language and grammar is so interesting and fun :-) I am always amazed at
how one language (English) can vary so greatly within and between countries.
When DH and I first were together we used to have arguments until we
discovered we were arguing about the same point of view; it was just that my
vocabulary was USA and his was NZ

Oh oh, I can see how this could easily happen.

Danish and Swedish are pretty similar, and once in High School we were
reading this Swedish text (Danish high school students have to read
other nordic literature too). Someone was translating and said "the
plums were dropping onto the water and floated the river". However, the
Swedish word for flowers is the same as the Danish word for plums. Very
romantic.

Another time I was cooking with a Norwegian friend of mine, I was
chopping onion and she turned around and said (in Norwegian) "are you
laughing?" I was like "what? no, I'm crying my eyes out" We had to
revert to English to clear the issue. One of the Norwegian words for
crying is the same as a Danish word for laughter.

How on earth these languages can be some close and then have issues like
that I'll never understand.

But yes, it is kind of fun.

If you ever do happen to spend some time 'south' give a yell, I can tell you
all the bestest places to live

Will do, will do!

Hanne



Shona in NZ


"Hanne Gottliebsen" wrote in message
...

It's me again (yes I did wrongly write eg. earlier).

Let me quote from Fowler (IME preferred by K academics + the one retired
English teacher who proofread my PhD thesis):

About i.e.
quote on
It is naturally preceded by a stop; it should not be followed by a comma
unless the sense requires one, to introduce a parenthesis for instance.
[italics on] He attacked reactionaries, i.e. those whose opinions
differed from his own[italic of], but [italics on] He attacked
reationaries, i.e., it would seem, those whose opinions etc.
quote of

For scientific papers (all I see are computer science, mathematics and a
few medical ones) usually British scientists do not put the comma, US
ones do. I don't have enough experience of Southern Hemisphere English
of any kind to comment :-) Maybe I need to spend a couple of years
somewhere a lot further South next...

Also, I don't think I ever use i.e. (but sometimes e.g.) in
non-scientific writing. And certainly one sometimes see papers with
_way_ too many i.e.s in them.

Like I think I said early on: a Columbian colleague of mine in the US
and I had to just declare a truce on the issue. When rewieving
eachothers papers, I did not take out his commas after i.e. and he did
not my "missing" ones. We never did co-author - tha tmight have caused
some discussion :-)


Hanne
-who spent 30 min last night going through book boxes trying to find her
copy of Fowler.

Shona in NZ wrote:

I agree with you Jack that both can replaced easily with English word

('for

example' and 'that is') unfortunately i.e. and e.g. run rife in

scientific

writing due to limits on publication space; it takes up far less page

space

to put i.e. or e.g. :-S

On your other point, my formal scientific training took place here in NZ

and

the comma after the period is one of those rules that got fairly well
imprinted. In fact there are lecturers out there that have taken the

comma

after e.g. and i.e. to the height of being grammatical "pet peeve" and

will

mark off extra if it is omitted (ask me how I know :-)). Perhaps it is

a

scientific thing rather than a more mainstream thing?

Shona finding the i.e./e.g. thread very interesting in NZ

"bogus address" wrote in message
...


Near as I know there should always be a comma after e.g. (and i.e.
for that matter) no matter what the english language. I was taught
USA english and now use New Zealand/Australian (~British) english.

The way I do it: "e.g." and "i.e." MUST have the full stops (they're
abbreviations), and because a comma following a full stop looks silly
you NEVER put one after either.

But both are Latin expressions for things you can equally well say
in English so it's better not to use them in the first place.

Most of my education was in New Zealand and I think this approach
is the usual one there. You haven't forgotten your American usages
as much as you think you have.

Alluding to another OT thread: grew up in New Zealand, spent more
than half my life in Scotland, born in a country I hardly remember
despite my accent mostly being from there. My answer to "where are
you from?" is "is it compulsory to be from anywhere in particular?"


======== Email to "j-c" at this site; email to "bogus" will bounce

========


Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131

6604760


http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/purrhome.html food intolerance data &

recipes,


Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files and CD-ROMs of Scottish

music.

got it, thanks! )

Shona in NZ wrote:

Hi Marissa,

I just sent a PDF copy to you. Let me know if you don't get it and I will
try again.

S in NZ

"Dr. Quilter" wrote in message
...

could you? no hurry, but I'd love to have a copy in my library for when
the doubts hit...

Shona in NZ wrote:





--
Dr. Quilter
Ambassador of Extraordinary Aliens
http://community.webshots.com/user/mvignali
(take the dog out before replying)