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Does Anyone Here Do Neon (It's Enclosed In Glass!)?



 
 
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  #1  
Old November 8th 08, 11:25 PM posted to rec.crafts.glass
Joe
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1
Default Does Anyone Here Do Neon (It's Enclosed In Glass!)?

Well, the Subject line says it all, at least for now.

Actually, I need to know what size drill to use to open up a LP screen on my
ribbon burner for use with Natural Gas.

Jeez, this ng has been kinda dead for the past few weeks. Look what happens when
one guy retires...

Joe
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  #2  
Old November 9th 08, 03:30 AM posted to rec.crafts.glass
Steve Ackman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 52
Default Does Anyone Here Do Neon (It's Enclosed In Glass!)?

In , on Sat, 08 Nov 2008
17:25:11 -0500, Joe, wrote:
Well, the Subject line says it all, at least for now.

Actually, I need to know what size drill to use to open up a LP screen on my
ribbon burner for use with Natural Gas.


Since LP contains roughly 2.4 times the energy per
cubic foot as natural gas, the area of the orifice for
natural gas would need to be 2.4 times the one for LP
given the same pressure. Possibly (probably?) you won't
have the same pressure, but since I have almost no
experience with Natural gas, I wouldn't stake anything
on that.

I'm not sure what you mean by "screen" but if it's
as I'm envisioning, I think you want to open (or
preferably change) the jet rather than the screen.

About the only experience I have with changing a gas
orifice size is this (which doesn't really apply to
your situation, but being as it's essentially the same
thing as a ribbon burner, might be of interest
nonetheless):
http://wizard.dyndns.org/machine/gas-jets.html

Jeez, this ng has been kinda dead for the past few weeks. Look what
happens when one guy retires...


You might want to ping Neon John in
alt.energy.homepower to drop by here for a better
answer.

--
☯☯


  #3  
Old November 9th 08, 09:16 PM posted to rec.crafts.glass
javahut
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 95
Default Does Anyone Here Do Neon (It's Enclosed In Glass!)?


"Steve Ackman" wrote in message
rg...
In , on Sat, 08 Nov 2008
17:25:11 -0500, Joe, wrote:
Well, the Subject line says it all, at least for now.

Actually, I need to know what size drill to use to open up a LP screen on
my
ribbon burner for use with Natural Gas.


Since LP contains roughly 2.4 times the energy per
cubic foot as natural gas, the area of the orifice for
natural gas would need to be 2.4 times the one for LP
given the same pressure. Possibly (probably?) you won't
have the same pressure, but since I have almost no
experience with Natural gas, I wouldn't stake anything
on that.

I'm not sure what you mean by "screen" but if it's
as I'm envisioning, I think you want to open (or
preferably change) the jet rather than the screen.

About the only experience I have with changing a gas
orifice size is this (which doesn't really apply to
your situation, but being as it's essentially the same
thing as a ribbon burner, might be of interest
nonetheless):
http://wizard.dyndns.org/machine/gas-jets.html

Jeez, this ng has been kinda dead for the past few weeks. Look what
happens when one guy retires...


You might want to ping Neon John in
alt.energy.homepower to drop by here for a better
answer.

--
??

Hey Joe, did you try the manufacturer or distributor of the burner to ask
them about the orfice, and that is what you want to change, not the screen.
You need a larger jet, but I don't know for sure how much larger without
knowing your burner. I have a friend that ran NG with his ribbon burner and
I could drop him a note to find out what he uses at what pressure.

Without questions, there isn't much activity.


  #4  
Old November 9th 08, 10:20 PM posted to rec.crafts.glass
Moonraker[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 186
Default Does Anyone Here Do Neon (It's Enclosed In Glass!)?


"Javahut" wrote in message
...
Without questions, there isn't much activity.



I've got a question, then?

Where's my long-promised DVD on making molds? ROTFLMAO


  #5  
Old November 10th 08, 03:29 PM posted to rec.crafts.glass
Joe
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4
Default Does Anyone Here Do Neon (It's Enclosed In Glass!)?

On Sun, 9 Nov 2008 15:16:22 -0500, "Javahut"
wrote:


"Steve Ackman" wrote in message
. org...
In , on Sat, 08 Nov 2008
17:25:11 -0500, Joe, wrote:
Well, the Subject line says it all, at least for now.

Actually, I need to know what size drill to use to open up a LP screen on
my
ribbon burner for use with Natural Gas.


Since LP contains roughly 2.4 times the energy per
cubic foot as natural gas, the area of the orifice for
natural gas would need to be 2.4 times the one for LP
given the same pressure. Possibly (probably?) you won't
have the same pressure, but since I have almost no
experience with Natural gas, I wouldn't stake anything
on that.

I'm not sure what you mean by "screen" but if it's
as I'm envisioning, I think you want to open (or
preferably change) the jet rather than the screen.

About the only experience I have with changing a gas
orifice size is this (which doesn't really apply to
your situation, but being as it's essentially the same
thing as a ribbon burner, might be of interest
nonetheless):
http://wizard.dyndns.org/machine/gas-jets.html

Jeez, this ng has been kinda dead for the past few weeks. Look what
happens when one guy retires...


You might want to ping Neon John in
alt.energy.homepower to drop by here for a better
answer.

--
??

Hey Joe, did you try the manufacturer or distributor of the burner to ask
them about the orfice, and that is what you want to change, not the screen.
You need a larger jet, but I don't know for sure how much larger without
knowing your burner. I have a friend that ran NG with his ribbon burner and
I could drop him a note to find out what he uses at what pressure.

Without questions, there isn't much activity.


A neon ribbon burner has no jet that I am aware of. The "screen" is
actually a metal plate full of small holes that, I guess, serves the
purpose of multiple jets. To change a ribbon burner from LP to NG, the
manufacturer just supplies a new screen. The burner head (with the
screen) sits on an "economizer", which basically just shuts most of
the gas off to just a pilot. The same economizer is used for both the
LP and the NG versions.

See: http://www.voltarc.com/NeonFabrication.htm##Burners
and scroll down to the 16" burners.

Unfortunately, I've been told the replacement screens are no longer
available, and the distributor hasn't been too forthcoming with the
information I need.

The type I have was made by Hyde or Voltarc (depending on age: I think
they were the same thing - at any rate I have one of each and they
look identical). I know there are ribbon burners of a more
conventional construction, but that's not what is normally used in
neon fabrication.

If you have a friend with a neon ribbon burner of this type, I'd
appreciate knowing what size the holes are. The dist. did tell me that
it's just a standard number drill, but he didn't remember what one. I
just plan to modify one screen, and leave the other intact, in case I
ever want to (have to?) go back to the expensive gas.

I'll also try the Neon John ping.

Thanks to you guys for your replies.
Joe
  #6  
Old November 11th 08, 06:07 AM posted to rec.crafts.glass
The Shadow
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 18
Default Does Anyone Here Do Neon (It's Enclosed In Glass!)?


" Moonraker" wrote in message
. ..

"Javahut" wrote in message
...
Without questions, there isn't much activity.



I've got a question, then?

Where's my long-promised DVD on making molds? ROTFLMAO

Hey, I got the ZingBrush on You Tube didn't I? What else you want?
You need to get that zingbrush web page going, for serious, I put that
address up there and then went looking and got surprised!!

You don't need that DVD, you got me!


  #7  
Old November 17th 08, 03:48 PM posted to rec.crafts.glass
javahut
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 95
Default Does Anyone Here Do Neon (It's Enclosed In Glass!)?


"Joe" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 9 Nov 2008 15:16:22 -0500, "Javahut"
wrote:


"Steve Ackman" wrote in message
.org...
In , on Sat, 08 Nov 2008
17:25:11 -0500, Joe, wrote:
Well, the Subject line says it all, at least for now.

Actually, I need to know what size drill to use to open up a LP screen
on
my
ribbon burner for use with Natural Gas.

Since LP contains roughly 2.4 times the energy per
cubic foot as natural gas, the area of the orifice for
natural gas would need to be 2.4 times the one for LP
given the same pressure. Possibly (probably?) you won't
have the same pressure, but since I have almost no
experience with Natural gas, I wouldn't stake anything
on that.

I'm not sure what you mean by "screen" but if it's
as I'm envisioning, I think you want to open (or
preferably change) the jet rather than the screen.

About the only experience I have with changing a gas
orifice size is this (which doesn't really apply to
your situation, but being as it's essentially the same
thing as a ribbon burner, might be of interest
nonetheless):
http://wizard.dyndns.org/machine/gas-jets.html

Jeez, this ng has been kinda dead for the past few weeks. Look what
happens when one guy retires...

You might want to ping Neon John in
alt.energy.homepower to drop by here for a better
answer.

--
??

Hey Joe, did you try the manufacturer or distributor of the burner to ask
them about the orfice, and that is what you want to change, not the
screen.
You need a larger jet, but I don't know for sure how much larger without
knowing your burner. I have a friend that ran NG with his ribbon burner
and
I could drop him a note to find out what he uses at what pressure.

Without questions, there isn't much activity.


A neon ribbon burner has no jet that I am aware of. The "screen" is
actually a metal plate full of small holes that, I guess, serves the
purpose of multiple jets. To change a ribbon burner from LP to NG, the
manufacturer just supplies a new screen. The burner head (with the
screen) sits on an "economizer", which basically just shuts most of
the gas off to just a pilot. The same economizer is used for both the
LP and the NG versions.

See: http://www.voltarc.com/NeonFabrication.htm##Burners
and scroll down to the 16" burners.

Unfortunately, I've been told the replacement screens are no longer
available, and the distributor hasn't been too forthcoming with the
information I need.

The type I have was made by Hyde or Voltarc (depending on age: I think
they were the same thing - at any rate I have one of each and they
look identical). I know there are ribbon burners of a more
conventional construction, but that's not what is normally used in
neon fabrication.

If you have a friend with a neon ribbon burner of this type, I'd
appreciate knowing what size the holes are. The dist. did tell me that
it's just a standard number drill, but he didn't remember what one. I
just plan to modify one screen, and leave the other intact, in case I
ever want to (have to?) go back to the expensive gas.

I'll also try the Neon John ping.

Thanks to you guys for your replies.
Joe


I don't see him often, I will try and get ahold of him to find out the
number drill that fits.


  #8  
Old November 17th 08, 07:16 PM posted to rec.crafts.glass
Chemo the Clown
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 143
Default Does Anyone Here Do Neon (It's Enclosed In Glass!)?

On Nov 10, 9:07*pm, "The Shadow" wrote:
" Moonraker" wrote in message

. ..

"Javahut" wrote in message
...
Without questions, there isn't much activity.


I've got a question, then?


Where's my long-promised DVD on making molds? *ROTFLMAO


Hey, I got the ZingBrush on You Tube didn't I? *What else you want?
You need to get that zingbrush web page going, for serious, I put that
address up there and then went looking and got surprised!!

You don't need that DVD, you got me!


That's a pretty crappy youtube video. Blurry and no sound. Makes me
wonder if it didn't come out of Canada somewhere.
  #9  
Old November 19th 08, 11:56 PM posted to rec.crafts.glass
javahut
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 95
Default Does Anyone Here Do Neon (It's Enclosed In Glass!)?


"Chemo the Clown" wrote in message
...
On Nov 10, 9:07 pm, "The Shadow" wrote:
" Moonraker" wrote in message

. ..

"Javahut" wrote in message
...
Without questions, there isn't much activity.


I've got a question, then?


Where's my long-promised DVD on making molds? ROTFLMAO


Hey, I got the ZingBrush on You Tube didn't I? What else you want?
You need to get that zingbrush web page going, for serious, I put that
address up there and then went looking and got surprised!!

You don't need that DVD, you got me!


That's a pretty crappy youtube video. Blurry and no sound. Makes me
wonder if it didn't come out of Canada somewhere.

First try at it and bite me, The lady running it is small in stature and
wings that thing around that window and does NOT have sore choulders from
buffing the window and you should see what it does on brass cabinet door
panels!! talk about glow!!

The video will be improved upon, but you get the drift...


  #10  
Old November 20th 08, 05:41 PM posted to rec.crafts.glass
Chemo the Clown
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 143
Default Does Anyone Here Do Neon (It's Enclosed In Glass!)?

On Nov 19, 2:56*pm, "Javahut" wrote:
"Chemo the Clown" wrote in ...
On Nov 10, 9:07 pm, "The Shadow" wrote:





" Moonraker" wrote in message


...


"Javahut" wrote in message
...
Without questions, there isn't much activity.


I've got a question, then?


Where's my long-promised DVD on making molds? ROTFLMAO


Hey, I got the ZingBrush on You Tube didn't I? What else you want?
You need to get that zingbrush web page going, for serious, I put that
address up there and then went looking and got surprised!!


You don't need that DVD, you got me!


That's a pretty crappy youtube video. Blurry and no sound. Makes me
wonder if it didn't come out of Canada somewhere.

First try at it and bite me, *The lady running it is small in stature and
wings that thing around that window and does NOT have sore choulders from
buffing the window and you should see what it does on brass cabinet door
panels!! *talk about glow!!

The video will be improved upon, but you get the drift...- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


Didn't realize you did the vid. BTW...what's the diff between the
zingbruch and the Pzazz brush. Both seem to do the same thing. I've
used the Pzazz for years and pretty sure I get the same result.
 




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