Swarovski Article

This bugs me so much, as well. Crystal is leaded glass. Firepolish is
regular pressed glass. I do use both - both definitely have their place.
But calling firepolished beads (usually Czech pressed glass) crystal is
inaccurate and misleading.

--
Kandice Seeber
Air & Earth Designs
http://www.lampwork.net

....And lets not get me started on my peeve about Firepolish being called
crystal....=o\

Beki
http://www.whimbeads.com

So just to clarify, just so I have this legally correct -

If I am selling Swarovski crystals by themselves, I need to identify them as
Austrian crystals unless I have a sighed written contract with them that
allows me to use their name in the description.

If I am selling a finished piece that Swarovski did not make, and that has
Swarovski components, I need to identify them as Austrian crystals. There's
no way to get around that because they would like to keep people from
confusing finished jewelry items that are made by them and those that are
not.

If I am including Swarovski beads as part of an auction, I need to refer to
them as Austrian crystals until I get permission.

Please let me know if this is correct - I think it is based on the rest of
the thread....
and if so, I need to change my auctions until I have obtained permission.
Can you only obtain permission if you are a dealer of the crystals? Thanks
for all the information - it really is eye-opening. I never knew the
legality until I read this thread. I imagine a lot of people on ebay have
no idea.
--
Kandice Seeber
Air & Earth Designs
http://www.lampwork.net

"All Swarovski is asking is that when an item is advertised as Swarovski,
it is
truely a Swarovski product."

OK, Now this is what I thought it was. And this is completely reasonable,
simple, and in keping with what I do. I have never advertised or identified
my work as "Swarovski". All my work is Tina's. I would never identify my
work with another name (including that of it's components), but I do
identify my materials.

Tina


"DreamBeadr" wrote in message
...
And also, if I can buy it as a Swarovski component/crystal bead, how
could I
be asked to mis-identify it by calling it something different.

Your not being asked to mis-identify it. It is an Austrian Crystal.
Or, it may be a Czech Crystal, a Chinese Crystal...etc.

All Swarovski is asking is that when an item is advertised as Swarovski,
it is
truely a Swarovski product. The only way they have to try and assure that
is
to authorize sellers to use their name.
Otherwise anyone could come along and say anything was a Swarovski bead.
And
there are several who do.

How about if made a lampwork bead, stuck it in a necklace and said the
bead was
made by Pati Walton? Yup...and it's only $16.00 for the entire necklace!
Good
deal, huh?
I bet Pati wouldn't feel that way about it.

Just because the company is large, and is worth a ton, doesn't mean they
don't
have the right to reserve the use of their family name.

Beki
http://www.whimbeads.com

Made in USA means I am supporting the workers in my country which means
something to me as a citizen, but it doesn't decree its value as better or
worse than any other. I've had good Swiss Chocolate and mediocre Swiss
chocolate. Same for Danish butter cookies, Turkish coffee, or Columbian
coffee either for that matter.

Are there NO other manufacturers of crystal in Austria? I would think there
would be, though perhaps no other major exporter. After all, Swarovski's
fame was not based on beads.

I don't have a problem with Swarovski making their own policies, but I do
have a problem with a manufacturer who will not allow me to identify what
the products I have used are -- products I have paid a premium price for,
partly because their name is attatched to it.

I eat US wild venison. Elk and deer are US wild venison. I do not eat
them. I eat caribou and moose.

I do use the term "Czech pressed glass", and though I will use the term
"Czech lampwork", I don't like to because there is such a diversity of
quality. If I had a more specific name I would use it.

Tina


"DreamBeadr" wrote in message
...
Identifying an article only by it's place of manufacture is ridiculous.

How do you identify beads from the Czech Republic? How about India?
Belgian
Chocolate? =o)

"Made in USA", for example, doesn't mean much of anything,

This probably wasn't where you were going with this comment, but the words
Made
in the USA mean a lot to me.

USA products can be either good stuff and crap just like
anywhere else.

The difference being that "Swarovski" products are not crap. But there
are
lots if inferior crystals on the market now. China coming to mind as one
of
the countries that will try to reproduce as many of Swarovski's shapes as
they
can.

I think if it were your family name behind a product that was being
copied, and
some unethical sellers were trying to pawn off the copies as your product,
you
might feel differently.

For myself, as a seller, I appreciate the fact that Swarovski is taking
this
stand.
While I accept that my business life is spent educating my customers, it
can
become very tiring to have them continually be fooled by an inferior
product at
a cut rate price.
I cannot stop all the unethical businesses, or even the ones who have been
misinformed and choose not to educate themselves.
Swarovski can give it a much better shot, however.

More than any of that, though. I respect their decision about their
business.

Beki
http://www.whimbeads.com

You are correct about everything Kandice.

Can you only obtain permission if you are a dealer of the crystals?

No, you can be a designer. I believe the cryteria for that is that you use
ONLY Swarovski products in your design. (with the exception of your stringing
material or findings of course). No other glass or crystal can be used in the
design.

I met with a vendor at the gift show last month. She has been selling
Swarovski product for over 35 years now. Pendants mostly. She has been
authorized for many years to use their name on her displays.
When some of the less expensive German pendant pieces came out, she had to ask
permission, and then wait for over 3 years before Swarovski would let her sell
those pieces and retain the use of their name at the same time.
She is very careful when setting up her displays. She also has pamplets that
are included with each sale identifying the different items.
These and a few other clauses were the only way Swarovski would allow her the
continued use of their name.
But, she knows that the name sells, and is willing to do whatever they ask to
continue with a good partnership with them.

They of course cannot police everyone, everywhere, but they are trying to find
as many ways to get this information out as possible. Including 1000's of
cease and desist letters that are sent out monthly.

Beki
http://www.whimbeads.com

I would never identify my
work with another name (including that of it's components), but I do
identify my materials.

Hi Tina...can you clarify this sentence for me...I don't get it. =o\

If I read you right, you are saying you don't use names to identify the
components in your work. ???
But you do for the materials? They are one and the same aren't they?

So cornfused....
Beki
http://www.whimbeads.com

Are there NO other manufacturers of crystal in Austria?

No, there are no other manufacturers of crystal beads in Austria.
Every crystal component made in Austria is under Swarovski control.

but I do
have a problem with a manufacturer who will not allow me to identify what
the products I have used are

Well, this is the thing. They are not telling you that you cannot identify
what the products are. It is fine to say they are Austrian Crystal. They have
a problem with people using the Swarovski name to identify crystal with.
Swarovski has no way of knowing that you are using their product, or not using
their product. You could very easily be using Czech glass beads and calling
them Swarovski for all they know. (not saying you are of course, Tina)

For every 1 person who knows the difference, there are probably 5 who either
don't care, or intentionally try to misrepresent, or just don't know the
difference.

A good example, and one that effects me as a business, and eventually anyone
who uses their product to elevate the level of quality of their work, is a
company that sells Chinese crystal beads. They set up a huge display at a
trade show. 99.5% of their product is made in China. They have one small
display container of Swarovski crystal beads.
They have 3 giant signs on 3 sides of their booth: SWAROVSKI CRYSTAL BEADS!
BEST PRICES AT THE SHOW!
There are no signs in the booth stating that anything is Chinese crystal.
For the full 4 days of this show, I heard 100's of times per day...no, don't
pay these prices, there is a booth right down there that has Swarovski crystal
beads for $3.00 per gross.
I didn't have the manpower or the time to stop each and every person in that
show who had been deceived and teach them how to distinguish one product from
another.
Instead, there were 1000's of beaders leaving that show who were, first, taken
advantage of, and second, mislead into thinking they were working with one
product when in fact it was another.
So, now there are all these beaders out there, selling, sharing, and using a
product that is labeled something other than what it is.
Trust me when I tell you that this will effect every single person down the
road.
Misrepresentation of a product is wrong.

I used the example of a Pati Walton bead in my previous post to try to relate
how this is wrong. To try to bring it to the level of an individual person. I
think we would all flock to the lampworkers defense if we knew someone was
using their name to market their product. Swarovski is no different.
And the only way they have to try to stop the issue is to ask people to not use
their name unless you have been authorized to do so.

Beki
http://www.whimbeads.com

If I had a more specific name I would use it.

There are many names of bead factories in the Czech Republic. However, neither
you nor I would be able to distinguish one pressed glass bead from another
based upon the name.
While there are different qualities of Czech glass, most specifically
firepolish, it is not denoted by the company name, but rather by the sellers
here in the US.
Preciosa makes Czech crystal. How many people do you know of who go around
saying their product is made with it?

The reason people want to use the Swarovski name is because it is famous.

Beki
http://www.whimbeads.com

Swarovski has it's rules and if you contact them, they will gladly send you
the information. I may even still have it on my computer.

I know that my friend who has a bead shop gets genuine Swarovskis because I
was there one day when a large order was delivered from her supplier. The
crystals were wrapped in a waxed tissue envelop with the Swarovski logo all
over it. (Okay, I could be sarcastic and say that her supplier could have
special ordered this envelop but that does seem a bit far fetched.)

If you want to be able to assure your customers that your items are made
with Swarovski crystals, submit the work and get their official
"Okie-Dokie".

"vj" wrote in message
...
vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from Kathy N-V
:

]Chuckle. Have you ever BEEN to Austria?
]
]If the Austrians decided that only one crystal maker would be allowed in
]their country, and that crystal maker would be Swarovski, it would be
done.

i understand that.
but forcing me to use "Austrian crystal" in my descriptions does not
assure my customers that they are buying Swarovski crystal. if you
see what i mean?


-----------
@vicki [SnuggleWench]
(Books) http://www.booksnbytes.com
(Jewelry) http://www.vickijean.com
newest creations: http://www.vickijean.com/new.html
-----------
The measure of the menace of a man is not what
hardware he carries, but what ideas he believes.-- Jeff Jordan

Wow - cool. Do you mind if I ask what the best course of action is to get
permission to use their name? I won't be selling the crystals themselves
alone, but just using them in my work and putting them with my handmade
beads on auction and on my website.

--
Kandice Seeber
Air & Earth Designs
http://www.lampwork.net

You are correct about everything Kandice.

Can you only obtain permission if you are a dealer of the crystals?

No, you can be a designer. I believe the cryteria for that is that you
use
ONLY Swarovski products in your design. (with the exception of your
stringing
material or findings of course). No other glass or crystal can be used in
the
design.

I met with a vendor at the gift show last month. She has been selling
Swarovski product for over 35 years now. Pendants mostly. She has been
authorized for many years to use their name on her displays.
When some of the less expensive German pendant pieces came out, she had to
ask
permission, and then wait for over 3 years before Swarovski would let her
sell
those pieces and retain the use of their name at the same time.
She is very careful when setting up her displays. She also has pamplets
that
are included with each sale identifying the different items.
These and a few other clauses were the only way Swarovski would allow her
the
continued use of their name.
But, she knows that the name sells, and is willing to do whatever they ask
to
continue with a good partnership with them.

They of course cannot police everyone, everywhere, but they are trying to
find
as many ways to get this information out as possible. Including 1000's of
cease and desist letters that are sent out monthly.

Beki
http://www.whimbeads.com