Grip to bring the rim in?

"Xtra News" wrote in message
...

OK rims, Hmm so difficult when you can't demonstrate.
when lifting, always go right to the top and then compact the rim with
left thumb and first finger either side of the rim and first finger of
right hand compacting down.

Yes - I have been doing that and it helps to do it as much as every pull for
me (being the unsteady newbie I am! Hehe!)

Shaping is just a carry on of shaping when lifting, pushing a little
harder in the inside if you want it flaring out, or on the outside if you
want it collaring.

I tried that, and what happens is that I have so far in to go to get
everything right in the middle, that the top edge becomes wavy on me.

Another trick (taught by Takeshi Yusada) is great. If the rim is off at
all, using your right hand (for right handed people) you put you first
finger in the pot, the others out and pressing down the "crutch" of your
first two fingers onto the rim, while squeezing in to the top part of the
walls with your fingers. It will fix up any wobbles or dodgyness that
might have happened.

Like making two legs with your first two fingers and "sitting on it"? Sounds
a good idea! I will try that!

Like I said it is so difficult to talk and not demostrate.

That's the trouble with discussing a very practical pursuit in text! HEhe!
But I think I know what you mean.

Rims always benifit from smoothing with a chamois, or for cheaper a strip
of wet folded newspaper.

Somewhere, some time, I got hold of this really thin sponge. It is easily
folded or bent over e.g. a rim and works great for now. I will grab me a
chamois when I finally find one! Haven't specifically looked for one, but I
bet they have it somewhere near the car polish :-)

Good luck.

Thank you! I am having much better luck for questioning and discussing.
Thanks to everyone for their great support and information!

Marianne

"Steve Mills" wrote in message
...
The collaring in process for me starts with the cylinder, next (and I
think this may be what Marianne is looking for) I hold my right hand
almost like a claw over the pot rim, place the 1st and 3rd fingers
against the outside wall with the 2nd finger against the inside wall,
and with the clay running smoothly through those fingers, *lean* the rim
inwards up to and beyond 45 degrees, helping the process with the left
had. Once that is done I make a circle with my thumbs and forefingers
around the cylinder below the inward leaning edge and tightening the
ring as I raise it upwards bring the rest of the cylinder in to the rim
diameter.

I'm printing this, in hopes that it becomes clearer when I read it and do it
at the same time ;-)

That's what I was thinking of, though - a special grip which helps you bring
the rim in, without it distorting (like it wants to). I will try the 3
fingers, though that's not exactly the one I used to use - but it is
similar! I just wish I could remember the one I used, as it worked a dream,
always without distortion, and then I was a REAL newbie newbie!

I hope this is fairly clear.

Hmmmm - almost. At the end you do what I call "collaring in", right? And
then, if you want the rim even narrower, you repeat until you get it so
close to the middle that you can close it?

Thanks for the input, Steve! You guys are great!

Marianne

In article , Bubbles
writes

"Steve Mills" wrote in message
...
The collaring in process for me starts with the cylinder,

I'm printing this, in hopes that it becomes clearer when I read it and do it
at the same time ;-)

That's what I was thinking of, though - a special grip which helps you bring
the rim in, without it distorting (like it wants to). I will try the 3
fingers, though that's not exactly the one I used to use - but it is
similar! I just wish I could remember the one I used, as it worked a dream,
always without distortion, and then I was a REAL newbie newbie!

I hope this is fairly clear.

Hmmmm - almost. At the end you do what I call "collaring in", right?
Right, that's what I've always known it as.
And
then, if you want the rim even narrower, you repeat until you get it so
close to the middle that you can close it?
Right again.



When I was first taught throwing, I was always told to start opening and
lifting a bottle or closed form with that shape in mind, and to begin
the closing/collaring process almost from the beginning. My Tutor's
words we *so that the clay knows from the start where it's got to
go*.
Strangely, making those forms is always easier if I follow that advice!
But then as we know, clay does seem to have a kinetic memory built in;
watch the way tall narrow forms carry on twisting during the firing,
especially to stoneware temps, and the corners of cut slabs distort
while drying!
--
Steve Mills
Bath
UK

"Steve Mills" wrote in message
...

When I was first taught throwing, I was always told to start opening and
lifting a bottle or closed form with that shape in mind, and to begin
the closing/collaring process almost from the beginning. My Tutor's
words we *so that the clay knows from the start where it's got to
go*.

Just now I am basically training myself to lift cylindars - but it gets a
little boring, and I don't need that many vases ;-)

So, I thought I would close the top of some of them to see if I could make
some covered jars. The thing is, I can't make the cylindar narrower than my
hand! So, I have to close the top in at the end in any case.

Your description of the grip has me half remembering the grip I learned. I
think I turned my left hand palm up, but I can't remember much more! Hehe!

Strangely, making those forms is always easier if I follow that advice!
But then as we know, clay does seem to have a kinetic memory built in;
watch the way tall narrow forms carry on twisting during the firing,
especially to stoneware temps, and the corners of cut slabs distort
while drying!

Mmmm! I was just reading about this in Vince Pitelka's book! Clay does have
memory, which you can especially have problems with if you roll slabs, since
you often only roll them in one direction. I guess when you throw, you are
actually also moving the clay in only one direction. (well - up and towards
you)

I will be making some slab-built oven dishes soon, and have decided that I
will roll out the slabs too thick in one direction, then turn them 90
degrees and roll again - to avoid cracking during drying, especially.

Marianne

This could get complicated!

Re Slab rolling (not using a machine).

I was taught to roll from the centre outwards in both directions, then
turn the slab 90 degrees and repeat the action, then turn it 45 degrees
and roll as before, then back to 90 and roll, then 45 again, and so on
'till it's the right thickness. This DOES virtually eliminate warping
and cracking, especially if you *release* the clay from the cloth each
time you change rolling direction (and of course use a grogged clay),

For smaller slabs I wedge a large-ish lump of clay and then wire cut the
slabs from the bottom, using guides, and lifting off the main lump to
remove the cut slab.

Steve
Bath
UK


In article , Bubbles
writes
Strangely, making those forms is always easier if I follow that advice!
But then as we know, clay does seem to have a kinetic memory built in;
watch the way tall narrow forms carry on twisting during the firing,
especially to stoneware temps, and the corners of cut slabs distort
while drying!

Mmmm! I was just reading about this in Vince Pitelka's book! Clay does have
memory, which you can especially have problems with if you roll slabs, since
you often only roll them in one direction. I guess when you throw, you are
actually also moving the clay in only one direction. (well - up and towards
you)

I will be making some slab-built oven dishes soon, and have decided that I
will roll out the slabs too thick in one direction, then turn them 90
degrees and roll again - to avoid cracking during drying, especially.

Marianne



--
Steve Mills
Bath
UK

Watching Royce McGlashen (well known NZ master potter) make a slab is
something else. He scoffs at the need for a slab roller or even a rolling
pin )
Some of his work
http://collections.ic.gc.ca/exhibiti...mcglashen.html

http://www.lopdell.org.nz/Online/200...mcglashan.html

Sometimes he does slab teapots too. He makes his slabs by slapping his clay
against a table and turning and slapping and turning a slapping. It is very
quick, very precise and fun to try.


"Steve Mills" wrote in message
...
This could get complicated!

Re Slab rolling (not using a machine).

I was taught to roll from the centre outwards in both directions, then
turn the slab 90 degrees and repeat the action, then turn it 45 degrees
and roll as before, then back to 90 and roll, then 45 again, and so on
'till it's the right thickness. This DOES virtually eliminate warping
and cracking, especially if you *release* the clay from the cloth each
time you change rolling direction (and of course use a grogged clay),

For smaller slabs I wedge a large-ish lump of clay and then wire cut the
slabs from the bottom, using guides, and lifting off the main lump to
remove the cut slab.

Steve
Bath
UK


In article , Bubbles
writes
Strangely, making those forms is always easier if I follow that advice!
But then as we know, clay does seem to have a kinetic memory built in;
watch the way tall narrow forms carry on twisting during the firing,
especially to stoneware temps, and the corners of cut slabs distort
while drying!

Mmmm! I was just reading about this in Vince Pitelka's book! Clay does
have
memory, which you can especially have problems with if you roll slabs,
since
you often only roll them in one direction. I guess when you throw, you are
actually also moving the clay in only one direction. (well - up and
towards
you)

I will be making some slab-built oven dishes soon, and have decided that I
will roll out the slabs too thick in one direction, then turn them 90
degrees and roll again - to avoid cracking during drying, especially.

Marianne



--
Steve Mills
Bath
UK

i only do slab this way. i actually sold my slab roller - never used
by me - because slapping out a slab is so fast & easy.

in a way it's like tapping a bowl to center before trimming. if it's
easy for you, that's the only way you do it.

it's also amaizingly easy to get REALLY thin clay this way!

see ya

steve