Soldering a silver braid necklace?

I have a necklace that I want to put a charm onto. The necklace has no clasp;
it is a 1-piece, continuous "rope" (braid) type with a solder joint on it
that I can feel.

How does one go about soldering such a necklace after it is "unsoldered" and
the charm put on?

Web references? Step-by-step instructions?

Thanks,
--
Please, no "Go Google this" replies. I wouldn't
ask a question here if I hadn't done that already.

DaveC

This is an invalid return address
Please reply in the news group

DaveC wrote:
I have a necklace that I want to put a charm onto. The necklace has no clasp;
it is a 1-piece, continuous "rope" (braid) type with a solder joint on it
that I can feel.

How does one go about soldering such a necklace after it is "unsoldered" and
the charm put on?

Web references? Step-by-step instructions?

Thanks,
A jobbing silversmith wouldnt normally unsolder the chain to put on a
charm, any more than you would turn a car on its side to do some work on
the underside.
you could of course! be that as it may,
how you attach the charm depends on several things such as the relative
sizes of the 2 items. Normally attachments are fitted with a jump ring
that goes over the chain and through a hole on the charm.
Its the jump ring thats soldered up to secure the 2 items together.

It also depends wether the necklace is of noble metal or base.
If the latter then youve a wider range of options .such as a nylon
braided loop or even a fishing snap swivel. Its normal for any hanging
item to be able to slide easily along a necklace, so it remains
comfortable as you move.
One would need to see the 2 items to suggest the best solution. A link
maybe? to a web address?

On Tue, 5 Apr 2005 08:04:30 -0700, Ted Frater wrote
(in article ):

One would need to see the 2 items to suggest the best solution.

http://k.domaindlx.com/magdesh/ChainRing.jpg

It's actually the ring on my finger, visible in the photo, that I want to
place on the chain. Both are silver, unknown (to me) composition.

I don't trust clasps and the like. I've had lady friends who lost jewelry
because of such failures. The necklace is large enough to be taken off over
my head when needed.

Thanks,
--
Please, no "Go Google this" replies. I wouldn't
ask a question here if I hadn't done that already.

DaveC

This is an invalid return address
Please reply in the news group

On Tue, 05 Apr 2005 18:40:01 -0700, in hõ DaveC wrote:


http://k.domaindlx.com/magdesh/ChainRing.jpg

It's actually the ring on my finger, visible in the photo, that I want to
place on the chain. Both are silver, unknown (to me) composition.

I don't trust clasps and the like. I've had lady friends who lost jewelry
because of such failures. The necklace is large enough to be taken off over
my head when needed.

Thanks,

Dave, you've got a couple strikes against you here. First off, silver chains can be
trickier to solder than gold ones, due partly to the ease with which they oxidize,
partly to the ease with which silver conducts heat (which tends to then draw solder
farther into a chain than you'd wish, creating a larger than desired stiff spot). And
rope chains are more complex to solder together properly than are those chains with more
easily accessible individual links. You might notice, for example, that your rope
chain's links are actually each made of two C shaped links "clasping hands" to form a
single link. Properly disassembling such a chain requires disassembling two or more
such links, and then reassembling them, which often can be done with the original
solder. But this is frankly not the type of chain a beginner should try without some
experience. You're more likely than not, to make a royal mess of it. Often the wire
from which they are made is not even solid, but is a hollow tube. Other rope chains may
have individual links which are not even soldered shut, but which are crimped. This is
generally limited to costume and lesser quality metals, but some silver chains are done
this way. Easy to take apart, but hard to put together in a manner where they'll stay
shut. And to top it off, silver is often rhodium electroplated. If your chain is
rhodium finished, then soldering it causes the rhodium plate to bubble up, which is not
generally fully repairable. looks terrible.

In short, until you've some good bit of experience doing silver or gold soldering (this
is NOT the same as using tin/lead solders with a soldering iron, such as is done with
electronics), I'd suggest that this either should not be done at all, or should be
contracted out to a person who's done this before, ie a pro.

Your other option, technically easier, is to cut the finger ring. But that's a rather
heavy ring, and properly finishing off the solder seam will also be at least slightly
difficult, once there's that rope chain running through the ring. Again, it's do-able,
but better to let a pro do it. Not completely beginner fare, if you wish a good job.

However, how about this idea? Insteadof running the chain fully through the finger
ring, fix the ring to the chain by tying the chain in a "turks head" knot. I think
that's how it's called.
suspend the chain, and let the hanging end loop go through the finger ring. Take that
end, open it out a bit, and pass the other end, from which you hung it, through the
loop. Pull it through, and you'll have the ring nicely suspended from the chain. Fully
secure while you wear it, it cannot come off. It's not sliding on the chain, but tied
to it. Yet you can also remove it any time you wish.

This option requires no cutting, no soldering, no chance of damage to anything, and
actually can look quite nice.

Just my two cents.

Peter

On Tue, 5 Apr 2005 18:52:37 -0700, Peter W.. Rowe, wrote
(in article ):

However, how about this idea? Insteadof running the chain fully through the
finger
ring, fix the ring to the chain by tying the chain in a "turks head" knot. I

think
that's how it's called.
suspend the chain, and let the hanging end loop go through the finger ring.
Take that
end, open it out a bit, and pass the other end, from which you hung it,
through the
loop. Pull it through, and you'll have the ring nicely suspended from the
chain. Fully
secure while you wear it, it cannot come off. It's not sliding on the chain,

but tied
to it. Yet you can also remove it any time you wish.

This option requires no cutting, no soldering, no chance of damage to
anything, and
actually can look quite nice.

Peter,
Thanks for your observations and comments.

As you say, no soldering solution will be easy.

I've used the Turk's knot before. If you always stay vertical, and rarely
move, it's a useable solution. But I've found the ring no longer on the chain
once or twice.

I've entertained this solution: such a knot, but finishing it off with a
small crimp ring above it to keep it from "untying". I might end up with
that.

Thanks again for your comments.
--
Please, no "Go Google this" replies. I wouldn't
ask a question here if I hadn't done that already.

DaveC

This is an invalid return address
Please reply in the news group

I was going to suggest the method of Turks head, then read your post.
It will also stop the ring sliding and wearing the chain away or vice
versa. .
Shirley






In message , "Peter W..
Rowe," writes
On Tue, 05 Apr 2005 18:40:01 -0700, in hõ DaveC wrote:


http://k.domaindlx.com/magdesh/ChainRing.jpg

It's actually the ring on my finger, visible in the photo, that I want to
place on the chain. Both are silver, unknown (to me) composition.

I don't trust clasps and the like. I've had lady friends who lost jewelry
because of such failures. The necklace is large enough to be taken off over
my head when needed.

Thanks,

Dave, you've got a couple strikes against you here. First off, silver
chains can be
trickier to solder than gold ones, due partly to the ease with which
they oxidize,
partly to the ease with which silver conducts heat (which tends to then
draw solder
farther into a chain than you'd wish, creating a larger than desired
stiff spot). And
rope chains are more complex to solder together properly than are those
chains with more
easily accessible individual links. You might notice, for example,
that your rope
chain's links are actually each made of two C shaped links "clasping
hands" to form a
single link. Properly disassembling such a chain requires
disassembling two or more
such links, and then reassembling them, which often can be done with
the original
solder. But this is frankly not the type of chain a beginner should
try without some
experience. You're more likely than not, to make a royal mess of it.
Often the wire
from which they are made is not even solid, but is a hollow tube.
Other rope chains may
have individual links which are not even soldered shut, but which are
crimped. This is
generally limited to costume and lesser quality metals, but some silver
chains are done
this way. Easy to take apart, but hard to put together in a manner
where they'll stay
shut. And to top it off, silver is often rhodium electroplated. If
your chain is
rhodium finished, then soldering it causes the rhodium plate to bubble
up, which is not
generally fully repairable. looks terrible.

In short, until you've some good bit of experience doing silver or gold
soldering (this
is NOT the same as using tin/lead solders with a soldering iron, such
as is done with
electronics), I'd suggest that this either should not be done at all,
or should be
contracted out to a person who's done this before, ie a pro.

Your other option, technically easier, is to cut the finger ring. But
that's a rather
heavy ring, and properly finishing off the solder seam will also be at
least slightly
difficult, once there's that rope chain running through the ring.
Again, it's do-able,
but better to let a pro do it. Not completely beginner fare, if you
wish a good job.

However, how about this idea? Insteadof running the chain fully
through the finger
ring, fix the ring to the chain by tying the chain in a "turks head"
knot. I think
that's how it's called.
suspend the chain, and let the hanging end loop go through the finger
ring. Take that
end, open it out a bit, and pass the other end, from which you hung it,
through the
loop. Pull it through, and you'll have the ring nicely suspended from
the chain. Fully
secure while you wear it, it cannot come off. It's not sliding on the
chain, but tied
to it. Yet you can also remove it any time you wish.

This option requires no cutting, no soldering, no chance of damage to
anything, and
actually can look quite nice.

Just my two cents.

Peter

--
Shirley Shone

But while it's over your head, there is no way that the ring can come off
the chain unless the chain breaks. And while it's off your head, you can
keep it in a box so that you don't lose either? Seems like the best
solution to me (I'm not very good at soldering at all, but knowing my
apparent fascination for taking stuff apart I'd probably cut the ring!) You
could always slip a small jump ring or something through the chain above the
knot if the links are wide enough. It probably wouldn't need soldering,
just closing firmly with pliers.

Charlie.

"DaveC" wrote in message
...
I've used the Turk's knot before. If you always stay vertical, and rarely
move, it's a useable solution. But I've found the ring no longer on the
chain
once or twice.

I've entertained this solution: such a knot, but finishing it off with a
small crimp ring above it to keep it from "untying". I might end up with
that.

Thanks again for your comments.
--
Please, no "Go Google this" replies. I wouldn't
ask a question here if I hadn't done that already.

DaveC

This is an invalid return address
Please reply in the news group

Dave,
If you don't trust the clasp, use two of them. The chances both will
open simultaneously are very low.
Other than that, before trying to solder your chain, I'd suggest that
you purchase a piece of rope chain and practice on it to see whether
you can make a satisfactory joint by soldering. Rope chains are not
expensive and are sold by the meter.
Sarit.

Sarit Wolfus- handcrafted jewelry
http://sarit-jewelry.com


DaveC wrote:
On Tue, 5 Apr 2005 08:04:30 -0700, Ted Frater wrote
(in article ):

One would need to see the 2 items to suggest the best solution.

http://k.domaindlx.com/magdesh/ChainRing.jpg

It's actually the ring on my finger, visible in the photo, that I
want to
place on the chain. Both are silver, unknown (to me) composition.

I don't trust clasps and the like. I've had lady friends who lost
jewelry
because of such failures. The necklace is large enough to be taken
off over
my head when needed.

Thanks,
--
Please, no "Go Google this" replies. I wouldn't
ask a question here if I hadn't done that already.

DaveC

This is an invalid return address
Please reply in the news group

On Wed, 06 Apr 2005 01:52:37 GMT, "Peter W.. Rowe,"
wrote:

However, how about this idea? Insteadof running the chain fully through the finger
ring, fix the ring to the chain by tying the chain in a "turks head" knot. I think
that's how it's called.
suspend the chain, and let the hanging end loop go through the finger ring. Take that
end, open it out a bit, and pass the other end, from which you hung it, through the
loop. Pull it through, and you'll have the ring nicely suspended from the chain. Fully
secure while you wear it, it cannot come off. It's not sliding on the chain, but tied
to it. Yet you can also remove it any time you wish.

This option requires no cutting, no soldering, no chance of damage to anything, and
actually can look quite nice.

He could also put the ring on a large leaf bail and close the bail
over the chain and the ring.

--
Marilee J. Layman

"Peter W.. Rowe," writes:

suspend the chain, and let the hanging end loop go through the
finger ring. Take that end, open it out a bit, and pass the other
end, from which you hung it, through the loop. Pull it through...

Sorry, as a IGKT member, I couldn't let this "turk's head" thing go
on. 8) 8) The knot you are describing is the "lark's head".

Here's a site with turk's head knots that all jewelry aficionados will
appreciate:
http://www.golden-knots.com/ring2.html

Here's a site with pictoral instructions for a lark's head knot:
http://www.elainecraft.com/instructi...truc.lark.html

You could attach the ring to the chain with a turk's head knot, but
that's not a job for a beginner wire worker either. 8)
--
Carol Wang http://www.daoofsilk.com/ The Dao of Silk
http://www.chineseknotting.org/ The Chinese Knotting Home Page
http://www.skate.org/ Information for the Figure Skating Fan