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#1
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Modeling clay as a substitute for "clay bars" for auto detailing?
[also being cross-posted to rec.autos.tech and rec.autos.misc]
Hello, For a while I've used what is called a "clay bar" product to remove surface contaminants from automobile paint finishes. It works very well -- it borders on a miracle product. How one uses it is to apply a lubricant (such as a soapy solution) to a small section of the car and one slides the clay bar over the wetted surface. Very quickly it smooths the finish out by removing embedded microscopic particles (rail dust, brake dust, tree sap, water deposits, etc.) which ordinary washing/scrubbing does not remove. The results are amazing -- the paint feels as smooth as a baby's behind. :^) Anyway, the commercial "clay bars" for auto detailing are relatively expensive (like $15 for a 4 oz. bar), and I can't help but think those clay bars are simply some kind of modeling clay with a huge profit margin attached. From some cursory online research, most of the automotive detailing clay bars are made out of natural clay (a couple clay bar products instead use synthetic polymers of some sort.) One person mentioned trying out inexpensive modeling clay and getting good results: http://list.miata.net/pipermail/miat...ry/009655.html In the article the author talks about paying a few dollars for a whole pound of clay, which means the clay need not be reused as much. Clay bars get dirty from all the stuff they pick up, so the more it is used the more likely it will scratch. So it's better not to overuse a clay bar, and this only adds to the cost of using them. With the cost of modeling clay so little, one can do one car (or even half a car) and throw the clay away for a fresh piece. Anyway, using modeling clay intrigues me. However, before rushing out to buy some modeling clay and trying it out myself, I'd like to get feedback from the modeling clay artist community regarding this. Do you believe the commercial automotive "clay bars" simply use some type of commercially-available modeling clay? Or are these truly special, made to "spec" by the clay companies, with nothing comparable sold to the modeling clay community? Of course, the biggest fear is that the particles in many modeling clays are not fine enough and will visibly haze the paint. Is modeling clay also rated by the size/fineness of the clay particles? I do know some auto detailing product companies offer fine and medium "clay bars" -- the medium ones are for tough jobs with the comment that polishing is required afterwards (thus, the medium clay bar must leave a "haze".) A last point is who are the major manufacturers of modeling clays? I am thinking of contacting them and trying to get feedback -- some might volunteer useful information on this topic. Your insights will be much appreciated. Thanks! Jon Noring (p.s., another person posted an interesting "recipe" for a clay bar lubricant, thus closing the loop on a "do-it-yourself" clay bar system -- most automotive clay bar products also include a lubricant of some sort: http://groups.google.com/groups?selm...&output=gplain ) |
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#2
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I would think that polymer clay would leave a film that might be difficult
to remove. Other modeling clays have an oil base that again would leave a film unless the water on the car would prevent this. The polymer clay might slide over the soapy finish without leaving a film but it's not cheap either though not as costly as your 4oz bar.. Maybe you ought to try small quantites of different clays and do some tests. A tack cloth won't work? -- Dawn Stubitsch http://www.thumbprintkids.com http://www.thumbprintkids.com/pages/caketoppers.html "Jon Noring" wrote in message ... [also being cross-posted to rec.autos.tech and rec.autos.misc] Hello, For a while I've used what is called a "clay bar" product to remove surface contaminants from automobile paint finishes. It works very well -- it borders on a miracle product. How one uses it is to apply a lubricant (such as a soapy solution) to a small section of the car and one slides the clay bar over the wetted surface. Very quickly it smooths the finish out by removing embedded microscopic particles (rail dust, brake dust, tree sap, water deposits, etc.) which ordinary washing/scrubbing does not remove. The results are amazing -- the paint feels as smooth as a baby's behind. :^) Anyway, the commercial "clay bars" for auto detailing are relatively expensive (like $15 for a 4 oz. bar), and I can't help but think those clay bars are simply some kind of modeling clay with a huge profit margin attached. From some cursory online research, most of the automotive detailing clay bars are made out of natural clay (a couple clay bar products instead use synthetic polymers of some sort.) One person mentioned trying out inexpensive modeling clay and getting good results: http://list.miata.net/pipermail/miat...ry/009655.html In the article the author talks about paying a few dollars for a whole pound of clay, which means the clay need not be reused as much. Clay bars get dirty from all the stuff they pick up, so the more it is used the more likely it will scratch. So it's better not to overuse a clay bar, and this only adds to the cost of using them. With the cost of modeling clay so little, one can do one car (or even half a car) and throw the clay away for a fresh piece. Anyway, using modeling clay intrigues me. However, before rushing out to buy some modeling clay and trying it out myself, I'd like to get feedback from the modeling clay artist community regarding this. Do you believe the commercial automotive "clay bars" simply use some type of commercially-available modeling clay? Or are these truly special, made to "spec" by the clay companies, with nothing comparable sold to the modeling clay community? Of course, the biggest fear is that the particles in many modeling clays are not fine enough and will visibly haze the paint. Is modeling clay also rated by the size/fineness of the clay particles? I do know some auto detailing product companies offer fine and medium "clay bars" -- the medium ones are for tough jobs with the comment that polishing is required afterwards (thus, the medium clay bar must leave a "haze".) A last point is who are the major manufacturers of modeling clays? I am thinking of contacting them and trying to get feedback -- some might volunteer useful information on this topic. Your insights will be much appreciated. Thanks! Jon Noring (p.s., another person posted an interesting "recipe" for a clay bar lubricant, thus closing the loop on a "do-it-yourself" clay bar system -- most automotive clay bar products also include a lubricant of some sort: http://groups.google.com/groups?selm...&output=gplain ) |
#3
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Dawn Stubitsch wrote:
I would think that polymer clay would leave a film that might be difficult to remove. Other modeling clays have an oil base that again would leave a film unless the water on the car would prevent this. The polymer clay might slide over the soapy finish without leaving a film but it's not cheap either though not as costly as your 4oz bar.. Maybe you ought to try small quantites of different clays and do some tests. A tack cloth won't work? I appreciate the quick feedback. I guess the first question to ask is what automotive "clay bars" are made out of. My online research shows that most are natural clay based (that's what they say they are), while a couple are synthetic (polymer?) For the natural clay bars, I have no idea if they are water-based or oil-based or ???. Details are certainly sparse. Are there any modeling clays used today which are natural clay, or has everyone switched to polymer clays? Experimentation is probably needed with various brands of modeling clays for use as clay bars. What brands are out there to try? (What I'd really like to know is who manufactures clay bars for the various companies which market clay bars to the auto detailing community, such as Mothers, Meguiars, etc., and from that determine if some modeling clays are essentially equivalent.) Anyone here (either in the automotive or modeling clay groups), who can clarify all of this? Thanks. Jon Noring |
#4
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Approximately 9/22/03 16:04, Dawn Stubitsch uttered for posterity:
I would think that polymer clay would leave a film that might be difficult to remove. Other modeling clays have an oil base that again would leave a film unless the water on the car would prevent this. The polymer clay might slide over the soapy finish without leaving a film but it's not cheap either though not as costly as your 4oz bar.. Maybe you ought to try small quantites of different clays and do some tests. A tack cloth won't work? Would think natural clay, as used in ceramics, etc. would work nicely as a fine abrasive. Whether or not it is close to the proper grain size for use as detailers clay have not one clue. The other problem with this type of clay is that it dries out both fast and unevenly. Would worry about small dried hunks scratching the paint surface. This of course presumes that the bulk clay being referred to is artisans clay and not plasticene or similar... in other words good old water softened pottery clay. For a car, I'd probably use finely ground pottery clay in a heavier lubricant that is water soluble, something about like glycerin in consistency. I'd suggest the OP ask some friendly detailers about using bulk clay, or making his own bulk clay. Then test it on someone else's car first. |
#5
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On Mon, 22 Sep 2003 23:21:55 GMT, Jon Noring wrote:
Dawn Stubitsch wrote: I would think that polymer clay would leave a film that might be difficult to remove. Other modeling clays have an oil base that again would leave a film unless the water on the car would prevent this. The polymer clay might slide over the soapy finish without leaving a film but it's not cheap either though not as costly as your 4oz bar.. Maybe you ought to try small quantites of different clays and do some tests. A tack cloth won't work? I appreciate the quick feedback. I guess the first question to ask is what automotive "clay bars" are made out of. My online research shows that most are natural clay based (that's what they say they are), while a couple are synthetic (polymer?) For the natural clay bars, I have no idea if they are water-based or oil-based or ???. Details are certainly sparse. Are there any modeling clays used today which are natural clay, or has everyone switched to polymer clays? Experimentation is probably needed with various brands of modeling clays for use as clay bars. What brands are out there to try? (What I'd really like to know is who manufactures clay bars for the various companies which market clay bars to the auto detailing community, such as Mothers, Meguiars, etc., and from that determine if some modeling clays are essentially equivalent.) Anyone here (either in the automotive or modeling clay groups), who can clarify all of this? Thanks. Jon Noring Try sci.materials ng. -- Regards, Boris Mohar Got Knock? - see: Viatrack Printed Circuit Designs http://www3.sympatico.ca/borism/ Aurora, Ontario |
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