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Surface Embroidery? (Lost in the Ether)
I tried posting this a few days ago, but I guess it got lost in the
ether because I never saw it show up. Here goes again. Fearing I sound like a complete airhead, would someone please explain to me what "surface embroidery" means? I've done embroidery before, but I never ran across that term until coming to this group. Since I'm feeling dumb already, please go easy on me, ok? Suze |
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#2
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would someone please explain
to me what "surface embroidery" means? Dear heavens, I won't claim to be a wealth of knowledge here, but as *I* understand it, surface embroidery is stuff like ribbon embroidery, or free hand stuff done on jeans or clothing or even crewel (I think). And I could be very wrong! Anything not considered counted would be surface embroidery, if *I* understand correctly.And I'm sure if I'm wrong, and I won't be surprised, one of the more knowledgeable among the readers here will elaborate and explain to us both. Tegan Who we are never changes. Who we think we are... does. - Unknown |
#3
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#4
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In the U.S. - but not all other parts of the Western world - surface
embroidery means: silk shading, Brazilian, ribbon work, couching, and those stitches most generally used without counting. HOWEVER: There IS some overlap. For instance, Schwalm is a counted embroidery, as is Ayshire, but it generally falls under the umbrella of "surface". Also, a refined surface embroidery stitcher will count threads on very fine grounds for things like stem or chain stitch. In Italy, it is called "classic embroidery", and does - or does not - include surface embroidery. All that we do here with floss, lace thread, pearl cottons and the like are embroidery. Counted embroidery *usually* (not always) means work on a ground of 40-ct or less. Also, the ground is normally very closely woven, whereas counted work is *usually* performed, in this day and age, on a more open weave. But it gets "sticky" because counted work can also be surface work - such as darning patterns, where most of the thread is on the surface. It's a slippery slope to try to understand it all. That's why, in so many cases, rather than using the "general" term, we have specific terms, such as: Colbert, Drawn thread, Hedebo, Reticella, ribbon, Brazilian, Casalguidi, shadow, and on and on it goes. In modern times, however, it's getting even more difficult. For instance, canvas embroiderers are borrowing from earlier finer embroiders (such as filet lace) and working the patterns on cavas. It's gettin' harder and harder to describe. I really dislike the term "surface embroidery" because it can lead one to think in terms that aren't necessarily cut and dried. I don't know when the term began to come into favor, because eons ago, it was just simply "embroidery" and there wasn't such a deliniation between counted stitching and "other" types of stitching. Dianne Suzanne wrote: I tried posting this a few days ago, but I guess it got lost in the ether because I never saw it show up. Here goes again. Fearing I sound like a complete airhead, would someone please explain to me what "surface embroidery" means? I've done embroidery before, but I never ran across that term until coming to this group. Since I'm feeling dumb already, please go easy on me, ok? Suze |
#6
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Tell them to add: Colcha, Casalguidi, Kolaska and a host of others big
grin. Some of these embroideries contain both drawn work (pulled and also withdrawn). Some of these contain counted work. For instance, shadow work can be counted even on extremely fine, transparent materials (bastiste, lawn). Punch (Rhodes) work can be counted or punched with a sail needle, depending upon ground. Canvas embroidery is now using designs where the canvas is split, so that you don't have "gridded" designs", but rather a real curved edge. I think it's really, really difficult to define this stuff. Freestyle, to me, means doing whatever you want without an apparent design inked on the cloth. That doesn't mean I'm right, just that is how I *think* about it. I find this whole topic fascinating. For instance, a recent topic opened up when a stitcher couldn't find a diagram to explain "twisted bars". The results of her search brought up two different examples. I looked things up here out of curiosity, and found that in earlier times, some of these were just shown how to execute without actually naming the process. I think it might be easier to just say the "what" rather than confining certain things to a file drawer with a label. What I mean is: We can say, "I love to do Schalm." Everyone rather knows what that is, or can look up pictures readily. Or, say "I love to do cross stitch more than anything". Both are embroidery, but the technique is different. Canvas embroidery, from penelope to congress cloth, is definitely in a league of its own. I could be mistaken, but I *think* that the terminology "counted stitching" is a very recent one. Therein might lie the problem, when it became so popular, everything else was just, well, unthinkable. Hope nobody gets their knickers in a knot. I may not be explaining that very well. Dianne Lynne Demmery wrote: My guild made a definition of Surface work for classification is a member's show. Surface work is: Metal thread Ribbon Embroidery Schwalm Crewel Smocking Brazilian Shadowwork White work Cutwork Broderie Englaise Hedebo Richelieu Mountmellic Ayreshire Stumpwork Freestyle Reticella Openwork These 3 can also be classified as countedwork as well. Drawnwork cutwork Hardanger Lynne (in Ottawa) By the Way, our guild show occurs on May 1 and 2 in Ottawa at Tapestry House, if you would like any more information email ovgsathotmail.com (LdyTegan) wrote in message ... would someone please explain to me what "surface embroidery" means? Dear heavens, I won't claim to be a wealth of knowledge here, but as *I* understand it, surface embroidery is stuff like ribbon embroidery, or free hand stuff done on jeans or clothing or even crewel (I think). And I could be very wrong! Anything not considered counted would be surface embroidery, if *I* understand correctly.And I'm sure if I'm wrong, and I won't be surprised, one of the more knowledgeable among the readers here will elaborate and explain to us both. Tegan Who we are never changes. Who we think we are... does. - Unknown |
#7
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This term can be used for many styles of embroidery. The main think
being that the bulk of the stitching sits on the surface of the material. Design a stitching good day, Janet http://www.jmddesigns.co.nz http://www.masterstitch.co.uk Get the JMD Newsletter: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jmdnewsletter/ |
#8
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Hi, Janet. The bulk of the thread lies on the surface in cross stitch
as well. Particularly with the Danish method. :-) See how slippery this gets? Dianne Janet M. Davies wrote: This term can be used for many styles of embroidery. The main think being that the bulk of the stitching sits on the surface of the material. Design a stitching good day, Janet http://www.jmddesigns.co.nz http://www.masterstitch.co.uk Get the JMD Newsletter: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jmdnewsletter/ |
#9
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The bulk of the thread lies on the surface in cross stitch
as well. Particularly with the Danish method. :-) See how slippery this gets? And now you see why I said I was sure more knowledgeable people would give better answers than I !!! LOL.. Goodness.. I can never even remember which way I do my cross stitch! Is it Danish or English??? LOL... or both depending where I'm heading at the moment?! I can't even be counted on to remember which style is Danish and which is English... sad but true.. LOL Tegan Who we are never changes. Who we think we are... does. - Unknown |
#10
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I wish I didn't have this "stuffy" way of writing. I talk the same way,
but it's easier to understand because I'm so animated when I talk, and my voice rises and falls like notes in a musical staff, and my face shows more expression than an actor's. So people understand better. And I'm always open to another's view. I'm a "challenger" by nature. Anyway - couching aside (was that Romanian or gold?) - What I note (in U.S.) is a divisive line drawn between those who quilt, those who do cross stitch, or Brazilian, or ribbon, or canvas, or so-called "heirloom", etc. A sort of, "I'm in this club and you can't join unless you abide by the rules: you can only do and like THIS type of stitchery." I'm not accusing cross stitchers of anything. I've seen this with quilters, smockers, heirloom stitchers, knitters, etc. etc. So, before I get off track and can't remember what point I'm trying to make: It also *seems* that, in order to denigrate those who like something other than cross stitch or samplers (which use other types of stitches), the word "embroidery" has gotten lost and a new term has emerged: surface stitchery. Don't ask me why, but I detest the word "stitchery." Now stop and think what that phrase sounds like. Puffy stuff. Fluffy clouds. "Oooooh, you do surface stitchery. *I* do samplers." (or canvas, or smocking or knitting . . . you get the picture). To go even further under the hood (just my personal observations from seeing the shift in terms through time), cross stitchers were introduced to aida and it became, "Ooooooh, you do stamped cross stitch?" Then linen became more prominent and it became, "Ooooooh, you cross stitch on aida? I do *counted stitch* on linen (or lugana or put in your favorite even weave)." So, now the big term is "counted work". See, even *these* stitchers can't say, "counted embroidery". ANY of these techniques can be from the very easy to the sublimely difficult. No matter the ground. And ALL of us started with something easy, with the exception of a few people who always start on something difficult even if they mess it up. It's how they learn and like to learn. Not too long ago, someone said something to the effect that cross stitch wasn't embroidery. That's how far this dividing notion has become. It's ALL embroidery. What I (personally) wish we would do is just say, when someone asks you what is your hobby, you answer "embroidery". If they're interested, you can go into detail and tell exactly what kind of embroidery you do. Or, refer to the particular one you're holding in your hand at the moment. Because, if you're doing a band sampler, chances are you're not just cross stitching, you're also adding stitches that used to be used exclusively on canvas, or drawn thread, or drawn fabric. Much of embroidery is mixed technique anyway. It's not one thing or another. And we change these types with time. As an example, Hardanger emb. was once done a "certain" way, and only white on white. But through time, new techniques were added, borrowed from other parts of the world, and colors were added. The same thing has happened to Schwalm and Casalguidi. I just saw a new design release, called whitework, and it was full of color in the center. Well, the minute you introduce color, you can't call it "whitework". It's simply embroidery. And why we don't want to use that term is beyond me. I love how the Italians solve this dilemma: It's either cross stitch or classic embroidery. Makes perfect sense to me. Brain just died. Dianne LdyTegan wrote: The bulk of the thread lies on the surface in cross stitch as well. Particularly with the Danish method. :-) See how slippery this gets? And now you see why I said I was sure more knowledgeable people would give better answers than I !!! LOL.. Goodness.. I can never even remember which way I do my cross stitch! Is it Danish or English??? LOL... or both depending where I'm heading at the moment?! I can't even be counted on to remember which style is Danish and which is English... sad but true.. LOL Tegan Who we are never changes. Who we think we are... does. - Unknown |
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