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#21
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vj wrote:
vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from eads (Cheryl) : ]I'm tired of being the world's charity organization... ]Charity begins at HOME... yes, indeed it should. ]India has had nearly a century to modernize - and got a good start from the ]British -- they have the means to get where we are today - if they would work ]at it like the American people did. yes, but they also have a completely different culture than what we had. and they're doing a VERY good job of taking our jobs at the moment. India started with a high population, which British occupation did nothing about, Had they been sensible, like the Americans, they would have slaughtered all the natives so they could start with a population vaccuum into which to grow. Instead, they withdrew and left the natives to rebuild after a century of opression. Had India been left alone, they would indeed have had the chance to progress at a normal rate. They were stunted by occupation. Of course, had they established a nice middle-class technology-based economy, the US would probably have sanctioned them back into the third world, anyway. -- -Kalera http://www.beadwife.com http://www.snipurl.com/kebay |
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#22
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I have simply marked this thread as read because it is far too emotional
to me; however, I wanted to give a big thanks to everyone who shares my belief that giving and helping just because you can is part of that which feeds our spirits. -- -Kalera http://www.beadwife.com http://www.snipurl.com/kebay |
#23
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Kalera wrote:
India has had nearly a century to modernize - and got a good start from the British -- they have the means to get where we are today - if they would work at it like the American people did. I'm sure that the British would have done a much better job, like America, had they butchered the natives and been able to start with a clean slate. The people who had first contact with the native population WERE British, and French and Spanish. Americans don't have some sort of exclusive claim, genetic imbalance, cultural bias or other individual condition that makes them the world's enslavers, butchers, racists or anything else. There's a LOT of history out there that isn't taught that should be. The people who butchered the natives in many countries weren't foreign interlopers, they were the people next door, and still are. It's easy to point the finger at America for the treatment of the indigenous population, and yes, it was wrong and it was horrible but it's also something that doesn't happen in the way it did in the US, certainly not the way it does in many, many other places today. We can at least say in the US that we've learned a bit from history, there are countries out there that are repeating it on a daily basis. Genocide isn't a problem of the past, it's a current issue. The problem is that the places where it happens are not of interest to the developed countries because there are no resources to exploit. If Hussein had been the head of many other countries with no oil or other resources, he'd still be in power, and the UN wouldn't do any more to him than they do to Mugabe or any other head of state where genocide is a way of life. -Su |
#24
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Kalera Stratton wrote:
I'm sure that the British would have done a much better job, like America, had they butchered the natives and been able to start with a clean slate. Ouch. And I was trying to be nice.... Arondelle -- ================================================== ========= To email me, empty the pond with a net |
#25
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yes, but they also have a completely different culture than what we
had. and they're doing a VERY good job of taking our jobs at the moment. Taking? Corporations are sending the jobs. Heaven help big business if these workers start to form unions. Cheap lobour will disappear and then the already eroding middle class of 'modern' countries will erode even further as the playing field levels. When that happens there will be a gearing up in shift in the political and economic balance that I can see happening now. It suits government and business to have you believe that third world countries are 'taking jobs'. It's the Zaphod Beeblbrox philosophy of politics - it distracts you from what is actually going on. There is no such thing as continued Status Quo. Look at Russia - the last 100 years is a micro-history of the global condition since we first stood on our hind legs. The USA has been a strong economic and politcal force in the last 75 years or so. It seems like forever but realistically, that's all it is. Before that it was Britain. Spain, Egypt, Byzantium, Incans and so forth have had their day. We can bitch, carp and moan all we like about change, but it's inevitable. China has been the sleeping economic giant that is now awakening. Japan, the economic miracle of the latter half of the 20th centuary, is seeing the first cracks. Globally we're on the leading edge of change. It's all very interesting, is it not? As for terrorism, all races and religions are guilty. Just because it happened in the past does not excuse it. The Native American. The Australian Aboriginals (did you know that the original Tasmanians were completely wiped out - is this not genocide?). The Maori. The Crusades. The Moors. The Romans. The Vandals. The Visigoths. To name a few. Depending on which side of the struggle you were on, you were either the innocent victim, the saviour of your creed or the oppressor. I feel for families on both sides who have lost loved ones. I wish it would all stop. But I'm realistic enough to know that the struggle has been waging back and forth for centuries. It's the ugly side of being human and will continue as long as it is in our nature to colonise. From what I see, it still is. We're a complicated species. I once read, "Better a small help early, than a large help late." I'll continue to sponsor my child in some kind of effort to reach across the globe and join hands with my fellow human. BTW, I once heard that, in terms of DNA, if we were dogs, we'd all be the same breed, that's how closely related we all are. Black, white, whatever, it's equivilant to the number of spots on a dalmation in terms of our difference from each other. -- Marisa (AU/NZ) www.galleryvittoria.com "She who dies with the biggest stash, wins." |
#26
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~~~**shrug** i did. but then your concerns about lack of birth control
and lack of environmental concerns [which are also valid] seem to be different than my concern that contributions might end up buying Kalishnakovs instead of going to disaster relief.~~~ ??? How so? Environmentalists have a long tradition of being peaceniks too, you know. Oh, I see -- maybe it's because I'm Russian and I'd be happy that "my people" are getting money in exchange for their weapons? Haw haw haw!!! |
#27
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~~~Arondelle, I think it's a very reasonable thing for the parent of
someone in military service "fighting terrorism", to ask if Muslim charities could be supporting terrorism. It's less "prejudice" than looking out for their children's lives.~~~ Oh my god -- I didn't know Jamie was overseas now. Is that true? |
#28
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~~~~You did sound like you were attacking Vicki, but that's
not a thing you would do, and I'm glad it wasn't your intent.~~~~ Went back. Read the post. Still see no attack. |
#29
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Brilliant.
~~~~~Taking? Corporations are sending the jobs. Heaven help big business if these workers start to form unions. Cheap lobour will disappear and then the already eroding middle class of 'modern' countries will erode even further as the playing field levels. When that happens there will be a gearing up in shift in the political and economic balance that I can see happening now. It suits government and business to have you believe that third world countries are 'taking jobs'. It's the Zaphod Beeblbrox philosophy of politics - it distracts you from what is actually going on. There is no such thing as continued Status Quo. Look at Russia - the last 100 years is a micro-history of the global condition since we first stood on our hind legs. The USA has been a strong economic and politcal force in the last 75 years or so. It seems like forever but realistically, that's all it is. Before that it was Britain. Spain, Egypt, Byzantium, Incans and so forth have had their day. We can bitch, carp and moan all we like about change, but it's inevitable. China has been the sleeping economic giant that is now awakening. Japan, the economic miracle of the latter half of the 20th centuary, is seeing the first cracks. Globally we're on the leading edge of change. It's all very interesting, is it not? As for terrorism, all races and religions are guilty. Just because it happened in the past does not excuse it. The Native American. The Australian Aboriginals (did you know that the original Tasmanians were completely wiped out - is this not genocide?). The Maori. The Crusades. The Moors. The Romans. The Vandals. The Visigoths. To name a few. Depending on which side of the struggle you were on, you were either the innocent victim, the saviour of your creed or the oppressor. I feel for families on both sides who have lost loved ones. I wish it would all stop. But I'm realistic enough to know that the struggle has been waging back and forth for centuries. It's the ugly side of being human and will continue as long as it is in our nature to colonise. From what I see, it still is. We're a complicated species. I once read, "Better a small help early, than a large help late." I'll continue to sponsor my child in some kind of effort to reach across the globe and join hands with my fellow human. BTW, I once heard that, in terms of DNA, if we were dogs, we'd all be the same breed, that's how closely related we all are. Black, white, whatever, it's equivilant to the number of spots on a dalmation in terms of our difference from each other. -- Marisa (AU/NZ) |
#30
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vj wrote:
vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from "Christina Peterson" : ]Arondelle, I think it's a very reasonable thing for the parent of someone ]in military service "fighting terrorism", to ask if Muslim charities could ]be supporting terrorism. It's less "prejudice" than looking out for their ]children's lives. You did sound like you were attacking Vicki, but that's ]not a thing you would do, and I'm glad it wasn't your intent. thanks, Tina. i think for me, concern for the kids in the military is always up near the top of the list. but there's also a civil war going on in Sri Lanka. and even within our own borders, we know how easy it is to siphon money off for other causes under one umbrella organization. even the UN isn't sacrosanct, what with the investigations into the 'oil for food' program. there's a legitimate concern about charities in many nations, unfortunately. and my concern was partly for people who might unwittingly wind up in trouble with our own government for sending a contribution to an organization they have on one of their lists. it's such a muddle. and my post said i didn't want to start an argument -- it was just something i wondered about. the LAST thing i need is to be accused of supporting a terrorist organization at this point! i honestly thought there might be a public list somewhere to look at. The civil war in Sri Lanka has caused some rather unique problems for the rescuers, etc. Apparetly the tsunami washed loose land mines and old unexploded ordinace. -- Melinda http://cust.idl.com.au/athol |
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