quilt class cliques

Just a lurker with a question -- I have taken many, many quilt classes.
Occasionally I've observed a clique among some of those attending which
really takes the enjoyment out of a normally fun experience where everyone
has a mutual interest. After attending two classes in a prepaid series,
it's happening again and I have no intention of dropping out. It's a very
small group and the store owner is probably already aware of the situation
and trying to ignore it. How does everyone else handle quilt class cliques?
TIA for any feedback on this topic.

Jan

Talk to the teacher. We hate this worse than students do...

Helen Howes

I've seen this in almost every workshop I have attended. I used to go
for fun, now I only go if I want to learn a specific technique. It is
hard to ignore it, but I have decided it is the price to pay for
learning. I can't mention it to the teacher - they're her cliques! I
wouldn't want to mention it anyway, really. They all go to lots of
workshops, and know one another very well. That's the reason mostly, I
think. Can't be helped. I still get the lesson g
..
In message , Jan
writes


Just a lurker with a question -- I have taken many, many quilt classes.
Occasionally I've observed a clique among some of those attending which
really takes the enjoyment out of a normally fun experience where everyone
has a mutual interest. After attending two classes in a prepaid series,
it's happening again and I have no intention of dropping out. It's a very
small group and the store owner is probably already aware of the situation
and trying to ignore it. How does everyone else handle quilt class cliques?
TIA for any feedback on this topic.

Jan



--
Best Regards
pat on the hill

On Wed, 12 Oct 2005 19:10:47 GMT, "Jan" wrote:

Just a lurker with a question -- I have taken many, many quilt classes.
Occasionally I've observed a clique among some of those attending which
really takes the enjoyment out of a normally fun experience where everyone
has a mutual interest. After attending two classes in a prepaid series,
it's happening again and I have no intention of dropping out. It's a very
small group and the store owner is probably already aware of the situation
and trying to ignore it. How does everyone else handle quilt class cliques?
TIA for any feedback on this topic.

Jan

Try to ignore them so you can learn. Basically the same thing you did
in high school.
Debra in VA
See my quilts at
http://community.webshots.com/user/debplayshere

Jan wrote:

Just a lurker with a question -- I have taken many, many quilt classes.
Occasionally I've observed a clique among some of those attending which
really takes the enjoyment out of a normally fun experience where everyone
has a mutual interest. After attending two classes in a prepaid series,
it's happening again and I have no intention of dropping out. It's a very
small group and the store owner is probably already aware of the situation
and trying to ignore it. How does everyone else handle quilt class cliques?
TIA for any feedback on this topic.

Jan


When I was teaching and cliques developed, I'd break them up by
regrouping the groups for different tasks. When you break up social
groupings and make working groups, it's amazing the talent you see develop!

I do this with my sewing with the kids in school, too. I can then teach
them to cooperate as well as sew!

--
Kate XXXXXX R.C.T.Q Madame Chef des Trolls
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.katedicey.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!

Are these people who were friends to begin with and decided to do a class
together? They aren't really interested in meeting anybody else. Maybe there
are a couple of other solo students you'd enjoy sitting next to. But it's a
great pity if the teacher allows a little group to take over her class and
dominate any discussion.
Roberta in D

"Jan" schrieb im Newsbeitrag
.. .


Just a lurker with a question -- I have taken many, many quilt classes.
Occasionally I've observed a clique among some of those attending which
really takes the enjoyment out of a normally fun experience where everyone
has a mutual interest. After attending two classes in a prepaid series,
it's happening again and I have no intention of dropping out. It's a very
small group and the store owner is probably already aware of the situation
and trying to ignore it. How does everyone else handle quilt class
cliques? TIA for any feedback on this topic.

Jan

Worst ones are when the teacher is part of the clique. Went to an
embroidery group where that happened. I continued till the Summer
break and then didn't go back. It really made me feel unwelcome, and I
found that everything I said was contradicted, but as most of the
conversations were about things/people within their group of friends,
I didn't need to say much anyway!

I now only go to classes where I really want to learn the technique,
or if the teacher is someone I really want to learn from. If its very
cliquey there's usually someone else on their own feeling exactly the
same way, so seek them out!
--
Sally at the Seaside~~~~~~~
http://community.webshots.com/user/sallyswin

On Thu, 13 Oct 2005 10:08:33 +0100, Kate Dicey
wrote:

Jan wrote:

Just a lurker with a question -- I have taken many, many quilt classes.
Occasionally I've observed a clique among some of those attending which
really takes the enjoyment out of a normally fun experience where everyone
has a mutual interest. After attending two classes in a prepaid series,
it's happening again and I have no intention of dropping out. It's a very
small group and the store owner is probably already aware of the situation
and trying to ignore it. How does everyone else handle quilt class cliques?
TIA for any feedback on this topic.

Jan


When I was teaching and cliques developed, I'd break them up by
regrouping the groups for different tasks. When you break up social
groupings and make working groups, it's amazing the talent you see develop!

I do this with my sewing with the kids in school, too. I can then teach
them to cooperate as well as sew!

Sally Swindells wrote:

Worst ones are when the teacher is part of the clique. Went to an
embroidery group where that happened. I continued till the Summer
break and then didn't go back. It really made me feel unwelcome, and I
found that everything I said was contradicted, but as most of the
conversations were about things/people within their group of friends,
I didn't need to say much anyway!

Equine quadruped on stilts mode
This is so unprofessional. No properly trained
teacher/instructor/coach in any subject should do this, in a school or
anywhere else. It is one of the lessons I learned really well when I
trained back in 1975-8! And with proper planning it is terribly easy to
avoid. I explain that I'm doing this so that there is a good
cross-fertilization of ideas and ways of approaching the task, so that
they learn not just from me but also from each other. With kids I
usually add the rider that social groups are excellent in their own way,
but pure work groups often work better for learning. Particularly shy
folk are often given a task that requires interaction with the group, in
a low-pressure manner so that they don't feel like they are on the spot.
High-profile folk that think they are leaders are often given a
quieter, time consuming task to stop them taking over! It's all part of
basic classroom management. And sometimes you can do it tactfully, and
sometimes you have to be blunt! With adult sewing groups, one of the
hardest cliques to sort out it the mother/daughter one! At the start of
these sessions I usually ask if there are any mom/daughter combinations,
and then tell them: Well, I'm gonna split you up! And I grin my wide
and evil grin! Then I explain why: 30 years in and out of a classroom
has taught me that folk learn better this way, and the mums and
daughters will get together after class and talk about what they did
that was different and learn from BOTH groups. It also takes the
daughters away from the possibility of 'Mum knows best' syndrome and her
taking over the daughter's work - which is belittling, annoying for me
and the daughter, and prevents Mum learning coz all she's doing is going
over the daughter's stuff!


I now only go to classes where I really want to learn the technique,
or if the teacher is someone I really want to learn from. If its very
cliquey there's usually someone else on their own feeling exactly the
same way, so seek them out!

And complain! Either to the teacher if it's the students being cliquey,
or to the management if it's the teacher.
puts High Horse back in stable

--
Kate XXXXXX R.C.T.Q Madame Chef des Trolls
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.katedicey.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!

Problem is - most (or, at least many) 'teachers' at quilt shops are someone
that knows how to do something and the quilt shop asks them to teach a
class. I'm not saying that they don't know how to do what they do well, I'm
just saying that they are not professionally trained teachers. Some of
them, even though they are very good at what they do, haven't the vaguest
idea how to teach someone else how to do it or how to manage a class.

Just about the worst class I ever attended was by a woman in our area who is
a wonderful machine quilter, but an absolutely horrible teacher. Pretty
soon her advertised classes didn't fill! She was the kind who thought her
word was law, there couldn't possibly be any other way to do something
except the way she said (and I never once saw her crack her face with a
smile!). A good teacher will say, "This is what works for me, maybe a
different way will work better for you." Or, "Learn my method and then try
other methods to see what works best for you."
--
Donna in Idaho
Website: www.LinusIdaho.org

"Kate Dicey" wrote in message
...

Equine quadruped on stilts mode
This is so unprofessional. No properly trained teacher/instructor/coach
in any subject should do this, in a school or anywhere else. It is one of
the lessons I learned really well when I trained back in 1975-8! And with
proper planning it is terribly easy to avoid. I explain that I'm doing
this so that there is a good cross-fertilization of ideas and ways of
approaching the task, so that they learn not just from me but also from
each other. With kids I usually add the rider that social groups are
excellent in their own way, but pure work groups often work better for
learning. Particularly shy folk are often given a task that requires
interaction with the group, in a low-pressure manner so that they don't
feel like they are on the spot. High-profile folk that think they are
leaders are often given a quieter, time consuming task to stop them taking
over! It's all part of basic classroom management. And sometimes you can
do it tactfully, and sometimes you have to be blunt! With adult sewing
groups, one of the hardest cliques to sort out it the mother/daughter one!
At the start of these sessions I usually ask if there are any mom/daughter
combinations, and then tell them: Well, I'm gonna split you up! And I
grin my wide and evil grin! Then I explain why: 30 years in and out of a
classroom has taught me that folk learn better this way, and the mums and
daughters will get together after class and talk about what they did that
was different and learn from BOTH groups. It also takes the daughters
away from the possibility of 'Mum knows best' syndrome and her taking over
the daughter's work - which is belittling, annoying for me and the
daughter, and prevents Mum learning coz all she's doing is going over the
daughter's stuff!


I now only go to classes where I really want to learn the technique,
or if the teacher is someone I really want to learn from. If its very
cliquey there's usually someone else on their own feeling exactly the
same way, so seek them out!

And complain! Either to the teacher if it's the students being cliquey,
or to the management if it's the teacher.
puts High Horse back in stable

--
Kate XXXXXX R.C.T.Q Madame Chef des Trolls
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.katedicey.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!

"Jan" wrote in message
.. .


Just a lurker with a question -- I have taken many, many quilt classes.
Occasionally I've observed a clique among some of those attending which
really takes the enjoyment out of a normally fun experience where everyone
has a mutual interest. After attending two classes in a prepaid series,
it's happening again and I have no intention of dropping out. It's a very
small group and the store owner is probably already aware of the situation
and trying to ignore it. How does everyone else handle quilt class
cliques? TIA for any feedback on this topic.

I don't get out often. I wouldn't call myself anti-social, or even lacking
social skills, but I'm really a homebody. So, when I take a quilt class, it
usually is with my friend Cathy. To others who come into the class, it is
obvious Cathy and I know each other. And yes, we sit near each other. But...
if you attended that class with us, would you think we were a clique?

I *HAVE* felt uncomfortable in large groups, especially when I was alone,
and especially when others seemed to all know each other, and to speak in
some sort of code about folks I didn't know. But, I've always asked myself
if the distress I felt was *REALLY* because the others were excluding me?
Or, was I feeling excluded because I wasn't 'in the loop'?

So, to answer your question...
IF I feel a group is purposefully excluding me to the point of my being
uncomfortable I will avoid the situation. (If I were taking classes, I would
speak to the teacher first, to give her a chance to correct the situation.
And yes, I *WOULD* request that my money be returned.)
However, if folks are not being rude, but are just clumping together
(perhaps because of common experiences, interests, or just plain knowing
each other for numbers of years) I modify MY behavior to enhance my
experience. For example, my sister is a Creative Memories consultant, and I
travel out of state to go to scrapbooking events. My sister has to circulate
the room, and if my other sister isn't there, I literally do not know
anyone. So, I arrive early so that I am able to choose a seat in the middle
of the action (2nd or 3rd in a row.. or perhaps right in the center of a
table. I introduce myself to the people around me, and I ask the person next
to me about HER project. I might make a comment on colors/materials she's
used. Almost always, I see something new to me, so I may comment on that. I
must say that I've had very little trouble trying to get other folks to talk
to me about themselves. Usually the time passes quickly and enjoyably, and
at the end I have made, if not new 'friends', at least new agreeable
acquaintances.