question about copyrights--an innocent question not meant to start a war

Hello,
I have a question about copyright law and patterns. I have been
thinking about this for a bit. Lets say I decided to get creative and
design a sweater. The sweater I am designing (not really but pretend
with me) has a 2" ribbing and cables on the front, back and sleeves.
The cables crisscross in the front and then go to the back where they
cross again. The ones on the sleeves just go down the sleeve. Now I did
the pattern and it looks cool so I decide I am going to sell the
sweater and maybe the pattern I created. How do I know that someone has
not already designed this sweater? There are only so many ways to make
cables and sweaters. Like I said this is just something I have been
curious about the past few days.
Kristine

Kristine wrote:
Hello,
I have a question about copyright law and patterns. I have been
thinking about this for a bit. Lets say I decided to get creative and
design a sweater. The sweater I am designing (not really but pretend
with me) has a 2" ribbing and cables on the front, back and sleeves.
The cables crisscross in the front and then go to the back where they
cross again. The ones on the sleeves just go down the sleeve. Now I
did the pattern and it looks cool so I decide I am going to sell the
sweater and maybe the pattern I created. How do I know that someone
has not already designed this sweater? There are only so many ways to
make cables and sweaters. Like I said this is just something I have
been curious about the past few days.

I have wondered the same thing, Kristine. I don't even know how you would do
a search to find out if someone else had already made this sweater. I hope
someone who *knows* responds.

Katherine

Kristine wrote:
Hello,
I have a question about copyright law and patterns. I have been
thinking about this for a bit. Lets say I decided to get creative and
design a sweater. The sweater I am designing (not really but pretend
with me) has a 2" ribbing and cables on the front, back and sleeves.
The cables crisscross in the front and then go to the back where they
cross again. The ones on the sleeves just go down the sleeve. Now I did
the pattern and it looks cool so I decide I am going to sell the
sweater and maybe the pattern I created. How do I know that someone has
not already designed this sweater? There are only so many ways to make
cables and sweaters. Like I said this is just something I have been
curious about the past few days.
Kristine

You seem to be in the United States, so you can consult
www.loc.gov/copyright for information on copyright. If it is a design
rather than a set of instructions that you want to protect,
http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/pac...ral/design.htm

"Kristine" skrev i melding
oups.com...
Hello,
I have a question about copyright law and patterns. I have been
thinking about this for a bit. Lets say I decided to get creative and
design a sweater. The sweater I am designing (not really but pretend
with me) has a 2" ribbing and cables on the front, back and sleeves.
The cables crisscross in the front and then go to the back where they
cross again. The ones on the sleeves just go down the sleeve. Now I
did
the pattern and it looks cool so I decide I am going to sell the
sweater and maybe the pattern I created. How do I know that someone
has
not already designed this sweater? There are only so many ways to make
cables and sweaters. Like I said this is just something I have been
curious about the past few days.
Kristine

Kristine, I am not American, and my view is just common sence...

I think, If YOU make the pattern,
there might be people who have made something similar,
BUT I think the two patterns hardly could be the same.
The shape will often vary too.
It would be easy to see/read that your pattern is constructed by you,
if you haven't used another one as base for your sweater.
(May be your shape is "the best!!"LOL)

If you see Norwegian sweaters, they often have the same "theme"
as pattern.
(some patterns are special old traditional,
but now I am talking about NEW variations)

IF you knit a sweater to sell,
and use the same compositions of patterns, as a copyrighted pattern,
you have violated the copyright.
But if you use parts of that pattern, put it together with others,
or put together with other borders,
other colores, constructed in a different way, f.ex.
it is YOUR construction.
(There are just a few "stars" which you vary in most patterns.)

There has been a case not long ago,
where a copyright owner claimed that his right was violated,
since the pattern just was altered a little bit, and used by a factory.
He got right, and I think he WAS right,
his pattern was very popular,
and the sweater factory which made the new,
wanted it to be as like the popular one as possible.

When YOU make a pattern, it's impossible to know
IF anyone has made a similar pattern.
I think at least you can be sure that no one has made a quite like
pattern!
When you make your own pattern, you also vary the shape.
But I think, IF I thought I would sell the model,
I would search a bit among similar patterns ...just in case...
:-))

AUD ;-)

Aud brought up a good point; the copyright laws of various countries
vary quite a bit, and in the case of Internet commerce the laws of
other jurisdictions might apply.

Here are two excellent online resources regarding copyright as it pertains
to craftspeople and knitters:

http://www.geocities.com/jbtocker/copyright/


http://www.girlfromauntie.com/copyright/

"Kristine" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hello,
I have a question about copyright law and patterns. I have been
thinking about this for a bit. Lets say I decided to get creative and
design a sweater. The sweater I am designing (not really but pretend
with me) has a 2" ribbing and cables on the front, back and sleeves.
The cables crisscross in the front and then go to the back where they
cross again. The ones on the sleeves just go down the sleeve. Now I did
the pattern and it looks cool so I decide I am going to sell the
sweater and maybe the pattern I created. How do I know that someone has
not already designed this sweater? There are only so many ways to make
cables and sweaters. Like I said this is just something I have been
curious about the past few days.
Kristine

Hi Kristine,

There's really no way to know if a design has been done before, without
having copies of every knitting pattern ever made. Though some of our
pattern collections may look like we've tried, having access to
everything just isn't possible :-)

I would suggest that you keep your working notes, and date them so that
you have them if anyone ever disputes that the design is your own.
You'd have to get legal advice as to what would stand up if a court
case ever arose, but I would assume a copy of your notes that are
witnessed might be good enough. Take the copy and your original notes
and the finished pattern to a justice of the peace when you first
finalise the design (I don't know if they have a different title
outside of Australia), and get them to witness that they were produced
on that date, and that the copies and the originals are the same.

Hope this helps,
Sarah

In article .com,
"Kristine" wrote:

I have a question about copyright law and patterns. I have been
thinking about this for a bit. Lets say I decided to get creative and
design a sweater. The sweater I am designing (not really but pretend
with me) has a 2" ribbing and cables on the front, back and sleeves.
The cables crisscross in the front and then go to the back where they
cross again. The ones on the sleeves just go down the sleeve. Now I did
the pattern and it looks cool so I decide I am going to sell the
sweater and maybe the pattern I created. How do I know that someone has
not already designed this sweater? There are only so many ways to make
cables and sweaters. Like I said this is just something I have been
curious about the past few days.

You don't. In fact, it is quite common for two designers to come up
with the same design. It only becomes an issue if you use the exact
wording of a pattern that looks like that and/or use someone else's
photograph of that pattern. So, for instance, I am making a shawl of my
own design. It is very simple and I'm sure someone else has made one
like it. If I were to write a pattern for it, though, I would write it
myself, in my own words and use the picture of my shawl. Should there
be another one out there like it, fine, but chances are it isn't the
exact same gauge, yarn, needle size, dimensions, color, etc.

Regards,
Ranee

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"Kristine" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hello,
I have a question about copyright law and patterns. I have been
thinking about this for a bit. Lets say I decided to get creative and
design a sweater. The sweater I am designing (not really but pretend
with me) has a 2" ribbing and cables on the front, back and sleeves.
The cables crisscross in the front and then go to the back where they
cross again. The ones on the sleeves just go down the sleeve. Now I did
the pattern and it looks cool so I decide I am going to sell the
sweater and maybe the pattern I created. How do I know that someone has
not already designed this sweater? There are only so many ways to make
cables and sweaters. Like I said this is just something I have been
curious about the past few days.
Kristine


It is my understanding that "techniques" (cables, yos,etc.) can not be
copyrighted. It is the combination of these techniques which can be. It is
the combination of these patterns that make the sweater "yours", as well as
the neck, sleeve and shoulder shaping. Changing the yarn, color, and/or
gauge does not void the copyright.

DA

Hi Kristine,

There's really no way to know if a design has been done before, without
having copies of every knitting pattern ever made. Though some of our
pattern collections may look like we've tried, having access to
everything just isn't possible :-)

I would suggest that you keep your working notes, and date them so that
you have them if anyone ever disputes that the design is your own.
You'd have to get legal advice as to what would stand up if a court
case ever arose, but I would assume a copy of your notes that are
witnessed might be good enough. Take the copy and your original notes
and the finished pattern to a justice of the peace when you first
finalise the design (I don't know if they have a different title
outside of Australia), and get them to witness that they were produced
on that date, and that the copies and the originals are the same.

Hope this helps,
Sarah

Sarah, in the US musicians often mail copies of songs that they have written
to themselves. The date on the mail provides proof of when the song was
written, and satisfies the US court system.
DA