Beginner Lampworking Questions

Hi all,

I've been puttering away at my hothead that my husband hooked to a
propane tank and I'm having some problems/questions that I'm hoping you
guys will be kind enough to help me with. I am starting to get a better
feel for making things that look like beads, at least in a general
shaping sense..hehe but these are my big hurdles at the moment.

Situation: Using all Moretti glass, HotHead torch with Propane tank
(fully ventilated and shield).

1) Using either Clear or Light blue over a thin cobalt base with tiny
cobalt stringers, the clear or light blue gets black in it.

I thought that if you kept it out of the blue pointed flame part you
wouldn't get that. Also while working the glass I'll see a lighter
colored part appear on the surface (not bubbles) more like an oil slick.
Is that the black getting onto the bead?

Once the black gets on the bead, can you make it go away?

2) If my problem is that I'm getting the glass too hot, should I switch
to a different color type? I thought I'd heard that the clear color (?)
was more touchy.

3) I had in mind a pretty bead tonight and after messing up two (I
think, they are in the blanket right now) I'm feeling a bit
disappointed. Not that I expect perfection, they weren't perfectly round
or any thing spectacular, just a cobalt base, clear or light blue casing
with a very thin cobalt stringer (man does thin stringer go nuts in the
flame!) It was cool. Anyway, the black got me down. I'm wondering if I
should just use colors that aren't transparent if I keep screwing up the
clears or transparents...

4) We have a fiber blanket for now, but I got a crock pot and need to
pick up the vermiculite. Will the crock pot and vermiculite keep beads
from cracking so much? No I'm not selling them. They still suck too
much. 8-) I just want to keep them for nostalgic purposes.

Well, that's mostly it for today. I'm probably just wigged out from
Frances and my mess ups got to me more than they should have.

Thanks everyone,
Wendy
Remove the ferret to email me.

It sounds like you have gunky propane. I would try a 1gal Coleman propane
you can get at Walmart for $3 for 3. If that doesn't give you the black
then it's your propane that's dirty. I had dirty propane too and it's very
frustrating.

--
Starlia Klopman
www.klopmanstudios.com


"Maeven" wrote in message
. ..
Hi all,

I've been puttering away at my hothead that my husband hooked to a
propane tank and I'm having some problems/questions that I'm hoping you
guys will be kind enough to help me with. I am starting to get a better
feel for making things that look like beads, at least in a general
shaping sense..hehe but these are my big hurdles at the moment.

Situation: Using all Moretti glass, HotHead torch with Propane tank
(fully ventilated and shield).

1) Using either Clear or Light blue over a thin cobalt base with tiny
cobalt stringers, the clear or light blue gets black in it.

I thought that if you kept it out of the blue pointed flame part you
wouldn't get that. Also while working the glass I'll see a lighter
colored part appear on the surface (not bubbles) more like an oil slick.
Is that the black getting onto the bead?

Once the black gets on the bead, can you make it go away?

2) If my problem is that I'm getting the glass too hot, should I switch
to a different color type? I thought I'd heard that the clear color (?)
was more touchy.

3) I had in mind a pretty bead tonight and after messing up two (I
think, they are in the blanket right now) I'm feeling a bit
disappointed. Not that I expect perfection, they weren't perfectly round
or any thing spectacular, just a cobalt base, clear or light blue casing
with a very thin cobalt stringer (man does thin stringer go nuts in the
flame!) It was cool. Anyway, the black got me down. I'm wondering if I
should just use colors that aren't transparent if I keep screwing up the
clears or transparents...

4) We have a fiber blanket for now, but I got a crock pot and need to
pick up the vermiculite. Will the crock pot and vermiculite keep beads
from cracking so much? No I'm not selling them. They still suck too
much. 8-) I just want to keep them for nostalgic purposes.

Well, that's mostly it for today. I'm probably just wigged out from
Frances and my mess ups got to me more than they should have.

Thanks everyone,
Wendy
Remove the ferret to email me.

I'm curious... shouldn't you be using MAPP gas as a single fuel? If you
use propane alone, I would think that's going to do all kinds of weird
things....

Karin

starlia wrote:

It sounds like you have gunky propane. I would try a 1gal Coleman propane
you can get at Walmart for $3 for 3. If that doesn't give you the black
then it's your propane that's dirty. I had dirty propane too and it's very
frustrating.

--
Starlia Klopman
www.klopmanstudios.com

"Maeven" wrote in message
. ..
Hi all,

I've been puttering away at my hothead that my husband hooked to a
propane tank and I'm having some problems/questions that I'm hoping you
guys will be kind enough to help me with. I am starting to get a better
feel for making things that look like beads, at least in a general
shaping sense..hehe but these are my big hurdles at the moment.

Situation: Using all Moretti glass, HotHead torch with Propane tank
(fully ventilated and shield).

1) Using either Clear or Light blue over a thin cobalt base with tiny
cobalt stringers, the clear or light blue gets black in it.

I thought that if you kept it out of the blue pointed flame part you
wouldn't get that. Also while working the glass I'll see a lighter
colored part appear on the surface (not bubbles) more like an oil slick.
Is that the black getting onto the bead?

Once the black gets on the bead, can you make it go away?

2) If my problem is that I'm getting the glass too hot, should I switch
to a different color type? I thought I'd heard that the clear color (?)
was more touchy.

3) I had in mind a pretty bead tonight and after messing up two (I
think, they are in the blanket right now) I'm feeling a bit
disappointed. Not that I expect perfection, they weren't perfectly round
or any thing spectacular, just a cobalt base, clear or light blue casing
with a very thin cobalt stringer (man does thin stringer go nuts in the
flame!) It was cool. Anyway, the black got me down. I'm wondering if I
should just use colors that aren't transparent if I keep screwing up the
clears or transparents...

4) We have a fiber blanket for now, but I got a crock pot and need to
pick up the vermiculite. Will the crock pot and vermiculite keep beads
from cracking so much? No I'm not selling them. They still suck too
much. 8-) I just want to keep them for nostalgic purposes.

Well, that's mostly it for today. I'm probably just wigged out from
Frances and my mess ups got to me more than they should have.

Thanks everyone,
Wendy
Remove the ferret to email me.

I think you are correct. Propane without an oxidizer will have a lot of
unburned carbon, which explains the black deposits.
MAPP gas burns more cleanly because the accelerant is built into the
formula.
Long term solution - get an oxy/propane setup. The difference in fuel
costs will pay for the torch and even a kiln over a year's time.

--
There are no mistakes, only unexplored techniques

"Karin Cernik" wrote in message
...
I'm curious... shouldn't you be using MAPP gas as a single fuel? If you
use propane alone, I would think that's going to do all kinds of weird
things....

Karin

starlia wrote:

It sounds like you have gunky propane. I would try a 1gal Coleman
propane
you can get at Walmart for $3 for 3. If that doesn't give you the black
then it's your propane that's dirty. I had dirty propane too and it's
very
frustrating.

--
Starlia Klopman
www.klopmanstudios.com

"Maeven" wrote in message
. ..
Hi all,

I've been puttering away at my hothead that my husband hooked to a
propane tank and I'm having some problems/questions that I'm hoping
you
guys will be kind enough to help me with. I am starting to get a
better
feel for making things that look like beads, at least in a general
shaping sense..hehe but these are my big hurdles at the moment.

Situation: Using all Moretti glass, HotHead torch with Propane tank
(fully ventilated and shield).

1) Using either Clear or Light blue over a thin cobalt base with tiny
cobalt stringers, the clear or light blue gets black in it.

I thought that if you kept it out of the blue pointed flame part you
wouldn't get that. Also while working the glass I'll see a lighter
colored part appear on the surface (not bubbles) more like an oil
slick.
Is that the black getting onto the bead?

Once the black gets on the bead, can you make it go away?

2) If my problem is that I'm getting the glass too hot, should I
switch
to a different color type? I thought I'd heard that the clear color
(?)
was more touchy.

3) I had in mind a pretty bead tonight and after messing up two (I
think, they are in the blanket right now) I'm feeling a bit
disappointed. Not that I expect perfection, they weren't perfectly
round
or any thing spectacular, just a cobalt base, clear or light blue
casing
with a very thin cobalt stringer (man does thin stringer go nuts in
the
flame!) It was cool. Anyway, the black got me down. I'm wondering if
I
should just use colors that aren't transparent if I keep screwing up
the
clears or transparents...

4) We have a fiber blanket for now, but I got a crock pot and need to
pick up the vermiculite. Will the crock pot and vermiculite keep beads
from cracking so much? No I'm not selling them. They still suck too
much. 8-) I just want to keep them for nostalgic purposes.

Well, that's mostly it for today. I'm probably just wigged out from
Frances and my mess ups got to me more than they should have.

Thanks everyone,
Wendy
Remove the ferret to email me.

Thanks Starlia, we're trying a new tank tonight. I'll let you know!

Wendy

starlia wrote:
It sounds like you have gunky propane. I would try a 1gal Coleman propane
you can get at Walmart for $3 for 3. If that doesn't give you the black
then it's your propane that's dirty. I had dirty propane too and it's very
frustrating.

--
Starlia Klopman
www.klopmanstudios.com


"Maeven" wrote in message
. ..

Hi all,

I've been puttering away at my hothead that my husband hooked to a
propane tank and I'm having some problems/questions that I'm hoping you
guys will be kind enough to help me with. I am starting to get a better
feel for making things that look like beads, at least in a general
shaping sense..hehe but these are my big hurdles at the moment.

Situation: Using all Moretti glass, HotHead torch with Propane tank
(fully ventilated and shield).

1) Using either Clear or Light blue over a thin cobalt base with tiny
cobalt stringers, the clear or light blue gets black in it.

I thought that if you kept it out of the blue pointed flame part you
wouldn't get that. Also while working the glass I'll see a lighter
colored part appear on the surface (not bubbles) more like an oil slick.
Is that the black getting onto the bead?

Once the black gets on the bead, can you make it go away?

2) If my problem is that I'm getting the glass too hot, should I switch
to a different color type? I thought I'd heard that the clear color (?)
was more touchy.

3) I had in mind a pretty bead tonight and after messing up two (I
think, they are in the blanket right now) I'm feeling a bit
disappointed. Not that I expect perfection, they weren't perfectly round
or any thing spectacular, just a cobalt base, clear or light blue casing
with a very thin cobalt stringer (man does thin stringer go nuts in the
flame!) It was cool. Anyway, the black got me down. I'm wondering if I
should just use colors that aren't transparent if I keep screwing up the
clears or transparents...

4) We have a fiber blanket for now, but I got a crock pot and need to
pick up the vermiculite. Will the crock pot and vermiculite keep beads
from cracking so much? No I'm not selling them. They still suck too
much. 8-) I just want to keep them for nostalgic purposes.

Well, that's mostly it for today. I'm probably just wigged out from
Frances and my mess ups got to me more than they should have.

Thanks everyone,
Wendy
Remove the ferret to email me.

I think it worked!!!!!! With the hurricanes we had a bunch of the little
propane tanks around for the lanterns and hubby hooked one up for me
tonight. I just did a bead with white center (so I could see any
brown/black) and a clear encasing and before I put it in the blanket I
didn't see any black! I am so excited...

He's going to check on getting a new big propane tank tomorrow. He works
right next to a propane station.

We're planning on moving to a Nortel minor but until we can afford it
and the oxy stuff with regulators and whatnot, we have to make due with
the Hot Head.

Buying all the plywood for the windows and the impact drill put us down
a bit. I can't wait for winter....sigh.

I just want to thank everyone again. I am having a blast and you all
have been so kind.

Wendy

Maeven wrote:

Thanks Starlia, we're trying a new tank tonight. I'll let you know!

Wendy

starlia wrote:

It sounds like you have gunky propane. I would try a 1gal Coleman
propane
you can get at Walmart for $3 for 3. If that doesn't give you the black
then it's your propane that's dirty. I had dirty propane too and it's
very
frustrating.

--
Starlia Klopman
www.klopmanstudios.com


"Maeven" wrote in message
. ..

Hi all,

I've been puttering away at my hothead that my husband hooked to a
propane tank and I'm having some problems/questions that I'm hoping you
guys will be kind enough to help me with. I am starting to get a better
feel for making things that look like beads, at least in a general
shaping sense..hehe but these are my big hurdles at the moment.

Situation: Using all Moretti glass, HotHead torch with Propane tank
(fully ventilated and shield).

1) Using either Clear or Light blue over a thin cobalt base with tiny
cobalt stringers, the clear or light blue gets black in it.

I thought that if you kept it out of the blue pointed flame part you
wouldn't get that. Also while working the glass I'll see a lighter
colored part appear on the surface (not bubbles) more like an oil slick.
Is that the black getting onto the bead?

Once the black gets on the bead, can you make it go away?

2) If my problem is that I'm getting the glass too hot, should I switch
to a different color type? I thought I'd heard that the clear color (?)
was more touchy.

3) I had in mind a pretty bead tonight and after messing up two (I
think, they are in the blanket right now) I'm feeling a bit
disappointed. Not that I expect perfection, they weren't perfectly round
or any thing spectacular, just a cobalt base, clear or light blue casing
with a very thin cobalt stringer (man does thin stringer go nuts in the
flame!) It was cool. Anyway, the black got me down. I'm wondering if I
should just use colors that aren't transparent if I keep screwing up the
clears or transparents...

4) We have a fiber blanket for now, but I got a crock pot and need to
pick up the vermiculite. Will the crock pot and vermiculite keep beads
from cracking so much? No I'm not selling them. They still suck too
much. 8-) I just want to keep them for nostalgic purposes.

Well, that's mostly it for today. I'm probably just wigged out from
Frances and my mess ups got to me more than they should have.

Thanks everyone,
Wendy
Remove the ferret to email me.

I've been puttering away at my hothead that my husband hooked to a
propane tank and I'm having some problems/questio

WELL -- ONE
you are supposed to use MAPP with a HOT HEAD... it wasn't designed for plain
propane -- which is probably the largest part of your problem.....

all of your black is carbonization problems -- because the propane does not
burn hot enough in a Hot Head torch.
Lampworkers who use Propane/Oxygen torches just have the Oxygen in the mix to
avoid this problem --

you can't do it... buy a MAPP tank....

) We have a fiber blanket for now, but I got a crock pot and need to
pick up the vermiculite. Will the crock pot and vermiculite keep beads
from cracking so much

ONLY if they are very very small beads...

read up on annealing -
http://www.dragonbeads.com/anneal.html
Cheryl
DRAGON BEADS
Flameworked beads and glass
http://www.dragonbeads.com/

That's fine too, with the right torch.

-Kalera
http://www.beadwife.com
http://www.snipurl.com/kebay


vj wrote:
vj found this in rec.crafts.beads, from "Louis Cage"
:

]get an oxy/propane setup.

what about oxygen/natural gas?

If you continue to have the same problem, try working an inch further
out in the flame. It will take you longer to get your glass melted, but
it should be cleaner.

-Kalera
http://www.beadwife.com
http://www.snipurl.com/kebay


Maeven wrote:
Thanks Starlia, we're trying a new tank tonight. I'll let you know!

Wendy

starlia wrote:

It sounds like you have gunky propane. I would try a 1gal Coleman
propane
you can get at Walmart for $3 for 3. If that doesn't give you the black
then it's your propane that's dirty. I had dirty propane too and it's
very
frustrating.

--
Starlia Klopman
www.klopmanstudios.com


"Maeven" wrote in message
. ..

Hi all,

I've been puttering away at my hothead that my husband hooked to a
propane tank and I'm having some problems/questions that I'm hoping you
guys will be kind enough to help me with. I am starting to get a better
feel for making things that look like beads, at least in a general
shaping sense..hehe but these are my big hurdles at the moment.

Situation: Using all Moretti glass, HotHead torch with Propane tank
(fully ventilated and shield).

1) Using either Clear or Light blue over a thin cobalt base with tiny
cobalt stringers, the clear or light blue gets black in it.

I thought that if you kept it out of the blue pointed flame part you
wouldn't get that. Also while working the glass I'll see a lighter
colored part appear on the surface (not bubbles) more like an oil slick.
Is that the black getting onto the bead?

Once the black gets on the bead, can you make it go away?

2) If my problem is that I'm getting the glass too hot, should I switch
to a different color type? I thought I'd heard that the clear color (?)
was more touchy.

3) I had in mind a pretty bead tonight and after messing up two (I
think, they are in the blanket right now) I'm feeling a bit
disappointed. Not that I expect perfection, they weren't perfectly round
or any thing spectacular, just a cobalt base, clear or light blue casing
with a very thin cobalt stringer (man does thin stringer go nuts in the
flame!) It was cool. Anyway, the black got me down. I'm wondering if I
should just use colors that aren't transparent if I keep screwing up the
clears or transparents...

4) We have a fiber blanket for now, but I got a crock pot and need to
pick up the vermiculite. Will the crock pot and vermiculite keep beads
from cracking so much? No I'm not selling them. They still suck too
much. 8-) I just want to keep them for nostalgic purposes.

Well, that's mostly it for today. I'm probably just wigged out from
Frances and my mess ups got to me more than they should have.

Thanks everyone,
Wendy
Remove the ferret to email me.

When you do upgrade to a Minor, if your house has natural gas you might
consider having a hookup put in for your torch... use the money you
would have spent on a propane regulator. Likewise, instead of buying an
oxygen regulator, putting a deposit down to rent a tank, and then paying
for weekly tank fill ups, consider buying a used oxygen concentrator
right from the start... you'll save lots of money over tanked oxygen,
oxygen concentrators are completely safe, and you won't have th hassle
of running out.

-Kalera
http://www.beadwife.com
http://www.snipurl.com/kebay


Maeven wrote:
I think it worked!!!!!! With the hurricanes we had a bunch of the little
propane tanks around for the lanterns and hubby hooked one up for me
tonight. I just did a bead with white center (so I could see any
brown/black) and a clear encasing and before I put it in the blanket I
didn't see any black! I am so excited...

He's going to check on getting a new big propane tank tomorrow. He works
right next to a propane station.

We're planning on moving to a Nortel minor but until we can afford it
and the oxy stuff with regulators and whatnot, we have to make due with
the Hot Head.

Buying all the plywood for the windows and the impact drill put us down
a bit. I can't wait for winter....sigh.

I just want to thank everyone again. I am having a blast and you all
have been so kind.

Wendy

Maeven wrote:

Thanks Starlia, we're trying a new tank tonight. I'll let you know!

Wendy

starlia wrote:

It sounds like you have gunky propane. I would try a 1gal Coleman
propane
you can get at Walmart for $3 for 3. If that doesn't give you the black
then it's your propane that's dirty. I had dirty propane too and
it's very
frustrating.

--
Starlia Klopman
www.klopmanstudios.com


"Maeven" wrote in message
. ..

Hi all,

I've been puttering away at my hothead that my husband hooked to a
propane tank and I'm having some problems/questions that I'm hoping you
guys will be kind enough to help me with. I am starting to get a better
feel for making things that look like beads, at least in a general
shaping sense..hehe but these are my big hurdles at the moment.

Situation: Using all Moretti glass, HotHead torch with Propane tank
(fully ventilated and shield).

1) Using either Clear or Light blue over a thin cobalt base with tiny
cobalt stringers, the clear or light blue gets black in it.

I thought that if you kept it out of the blue pointed flame part you
wouldn't get that. Also while working the glass I'll see a lighter
colored part appear on the surface (not bubbles) more like an oil
slick.
Is that the black getting onto the bead?

Once the black gets on the bead, can you make it go away?

2) If my problem is that I'm getting the glass too hot, should I switch
to a different color type? I thought I'd heard that the clear color
(?)
was more touchy.

3) I had in mind a pretty bead tonight and after messing up two (I
think, they are in the blanket right now) I'm feeling a bit
disappointed. Not that I expect perfection, they weren't perfectly
round
or any thing spectacular, just a cobalt base, clear or light blue
casing
with a very thin cobalt stringer (man does thin stringer go nuts in the
flame!) It was cool. Anyway, the black got me down. I'm wondering
if I
should just use colors that aren't transparent if I keep screwing up
the
clears or transparents...

4) We have a fiber blanket for now, but I got a crock pot and need to
pick up the vermiculite. Will the crock pot and vermiculite keep beads
from cracking so much? No I'm not selling them. They still suck too
much. 8-) I just want to keep them for nostalgic purposes.

Well, that's mostly it for today. I'm probably just wigged out from
Frances and my mess ups got to me more than they should have.

Thanks everyone,
Wendy
Remove the ferret to email me.