My luck runnith out

Seems like my wife is not meant to have a silver fork like mine.

The first one developed a fracture in the shank and eventually failed. The
second one ditto on one of the tines and it just fell off when I tried to
solder it.

I suspect the problem is the hodgepodge metal I used so I am now melting
some virgin silver and copper and will give it another go.

As a point of interest, if one repairs a fork by soldering in a new tine,
would this not temper out all the hardness developed in the forging process?
Is there anyway to harden silver after the job is complete?

js

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"Jack Schmidling" wrote in message
...
Seems like my wife is not meant to have a silver fork like mine.

The first one developed a fracture in the shank and eventually failed.
The
second one ditto on one of the tines and it just fell off when I tried to
solder it.

I suspect the problem is the hodgepodge metal I used so I am now melting
some virgin silver and copper and will give it another go.

As a point of interest, if one repairs a fork by soldering in a new tine,
would this not temper out all the hardness developed in the forging
process?
Is there anyway to harden silver after the job is complete?

js

[It sounds like you're forging on this fork after casting it. This is a
severe way of testing the quality of your castings. Small flux inclusions,
places where hot metal attached to semi-cooled metal, areas of porosity, or
just coarse recrystallization on cooling will all cause weak spots that will
fail under stress. New metal might help, but it's not a panacea.

Hardening and tempering work differently in silver than they do in carbon
steel. The ability of steel to soften with heat to a plastic state, to
harden when quenched from red-hot, and to "temper" (lose some hardness)
with controlled heat are all unique properties of that material. Sterling
silver tends to fracture when heated and stressed, it softens when quenched
from red heat, and tempering has little effect. The only way I've ever
managed to harden it is by light hammering or twisting - this is
"work-hardening" and different from the effect of quenching on steel. I've
heard of age-hardening and cryo-hardening for non-ferrous alloys, but I'm
not sure how these processes work, or whether they're practical for studio
use. Commercially, flatware isn't cast; it's stamped out from heavy plate,
which gives it uniform metallurgical structure and some hardening from the
stamping process. Good luck with your experiments...]

Andrew Werby
www.unitedartworks.com

I read something recently about hardening silver ( I think it was silver).
You anneal it then quench it and put it in a kiln at a low temp for about an
hour. Don't remember where I read this.

--
Connie Ryman
Cryman Studio

"Jack Schmidling" wrote in message
...
Seems like my wife is not meant to have a silver fork like mine.

The first one developed a fracture in the shank and eventually failed.
The
second one ditto on one of the tines and it just fell off when I tried to
solder it.

I suspect the problem is the hodgepodge metal I used so I am now melting
some virgin silver and copper and will give it another go.

As a point of interest, if one repairs a fork by soldering in a new tine,
would this not temper out all the hardness developed in the forging
process?
Is there anyway to harden silver after the job is complete?

js

--
PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.netfirms.com/pow.htm
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"Andrew Werby"

[It sounds like you're forging on this fork after casting it. This is a
severe way of testing the quality of your castings. Small flux inclusions,
places where hot metal attached to semi-cooled metal, areas of porosity,
or
just coarse recrystallization on cooling will all cause weak spots that
will
fail under stress. New metal might help, but it's not a panacea....

The good news is it worked. My thrid attempt with new alloy went very
smoothly and the fork was ready for sea trials by dinner time.

The only way I've ever managed to harden it is by light hammering or
twisting - this is
"work-hardening" and different from the effect of quenching on steel.....

Roger on that but it does seem to work well enough for flatware. My first
attempt was a butter knife which I have now put an edge on and it seems to
cut most anything one would eat.

Commercially, flatware isn't cast; it's stamped out from heavy plate...

My two ton arbor press is probably not up to the task.

Kinda of fun this way. I now have two knives and two forks and working on
a spoon. They weigh in at about about 150 grams each.

js


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"Jack Schmidling" wrote in message
...

Commercially, flatware isn't cast; it's stamped out from heavy plate...

My two ton arbor press is probably not up to the task.

I've seen it done by hand in a demonstration a few years ago.

1. Blank cutout of flatware item is placed in die mounted on wooden stump

2. Other half of die is placed on top.

3. Huge man with sledge hammer hits top of die very hard...

4. Complete item is removed from die.

--
William Black
------------------
Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords
is no basis for a system of government

"William Black"

3. Huge man with sledge hammer hits top of die very hard...

4. Complete item is removed from die.

I think I like my way better at least for two pieces.

js


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In the Rio Grande "Gems & Findings" catalog on page 39, it says "To harden
sterling silver, heat it to 600 degrees Fahrenheit for 30-50 minutes in a
kiln or furnace. Air-cool the sterling silver before pickling. The hardness
will be equal to the hardness achieved by cold-working it to a 50% reduction
(or 3/4 hard)." I suppose this isn't much help unless you happen to have an
oven that can do that, but what you wrote made me remember reading this in
the catalog.

"C Ryman" wrote in message
...
I read something recently about hardening silver ( I think it was silver).
You anneal it then quench it and put it in a kiln at a low temp for about
an
hour. Don't remember where I read this.

--
Connie Ryman
Cryman Studio

"Jack Schmidling" wrote in message
...
Seems like my wife is not meant to have a silver fork like mine.

The first one developed a fracture in the shank and eventually failed.
The
second one ditto on one of the tines and it just fell off when I tried
to
solder it.

I suspect the problem is the hodgepodge metal I used so I am now melting
some virgin silver and copper and will give it another go.

As a point of interest, if one repairs a fork by soldering in a new
tine,
would this not temper out all the hardness developed in the forging
process?
Is there anyway to harden silver after the job is complete?

js

--
PHOTO OF THE WEEK: http://schmidling.netfirms.com/pow.htm
Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Gems, Sausage, http://schmidling.netfirms.com