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Traditional Dutch Fishermen's Sweaters



 
 
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  #11  
Old July 12th 07, 06:40 PM posted to rec.crafts.textiles.yarn
Katherine
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Posts: 899
Default Traditional Dutch Fishermen's Sweaters

On Jul 10, 9:41 pm, "Aaron Lewis" wrote:
Has anybody ever hear of "fisherman's sweaters" that were knit large, and
felted to size? I know of traditions of socks that were felted; and,
traditions of mittens that were felted and worn wet, but whole sweaters that
were knit large and felted?

The fellow who proposed this was a curator at a museum. The museum does not
have any examples, and when I look at photos of fishermen from the same
period that sailed out of a port only 100 miles from the subject port, I do
not see ANY evidence of felting. Knitters and knitting shop owners in the
area do not seem to be aware of such a tradition, but such traditions die
fast.


I have never heard of this, Aaron, and I really can't imagine it. Just
think
how heavy such a garment would be!

Higs,
Katherine

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  #12  
Old July 12th 07, 07:59 PM posted to rec.crafts.textiles.yarn
Aaron Lewis
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Posts: 65
Default Traditional Dutch Fishermen's Sweaters

Would you consider the photos on
http://gansey.blogspot.com/2007_03_01_archive.html to look knitted or
felted?

It was knitted, but most knitters that touch and feel it, make a comment
that it must be felted. It is not - yet!

That gansey is now navy blue. I wore it as I chatted with enactors on the
ramparts of Louisburg. In their replicas of 1744 French Army uniforms with
BOILED wool coats, the enactors' finger tips were blue and their teeth were
chattering. My wife was wearing two layers of Patagonia pile under a
mountain parka and was also warm enough. I was wearing the gansey over a
jersey. I was warm and had more freedom of motion than either the enactors
or my wife. (We were actually out in the wind longer than any of the
enactors.) The wind on the walls of Louisburg did inspire me to knit a
warmer hat for myself in preparation for my cod fishing trip.

That gansey has now been cod fishing on the banks off PEI and sailing on the
Bluenose II. I wore it hiking in the rain and mist as we looked for moose,
and as we sat on the headlands of Cape Breton watching pilot whales in the
white capped waters below. The coldest place I wore it was on the beach
where Cabot is said to have first landed in the New World. The warmest
place that I wore it was drinking beer at a sidewalk pub in Halifax.

The firmness of the gansey fabric along with the loose sleeves allows it to
vent through the large neck opening in warmer (60F) conditions. This
venting is dramatically reduced by wearing a garment under the gansey, or
carrying a backpack. (Note however that the gansey, fits snugger than many
modern "fishermen's sweaters".) Otherwise, I have never owned a garment
that was so comfortable in such a variety of different weather. If I had not
knitted it myself, I would say it was magic. It was worth every hour of its
knitting. It gets worn a lot!

I cannot knit that tight with circular needles. (At least not without
eventually ruining my wrists.) Gansey needles and knitting sheaths are still
a marvel of technology.

I bought a fist full of DPN as I geared up for the trip. Wooden needles
are good for not dropping stitches while knitting on the go, but steel
needles are faster. Air security did not take my needles away from me - not
even the 7" steel DPN, but on the plane, I ended up knitting with wooden
needles. (I did check the gansey needles.)

Oh, and the little bands that they put around lobster claws are perfect for
keeping stitches on your needles. Lets see, for 4 needles you will need 8
bands - as if we needed another reason for eating lobster! LOL

Aaron

"Vintage Purls" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Jul 12, 6:34 am, "Aaron Lewis" wrote:
Many people that see my gansey have to be convinced that it is not
felted.
They just assume that anything that tight MUST have been felted.


The felted sweaters in "Knitting from the Netherlands" don't look
tight, they look felted. They look very thick and stiff. All of the
studio photos show men in fine "fishermen's sweaters" that would have
never seen a boat in their lives - these sweaters were for Sunday
best. No one would have worn their work jersey for a formal portrait.
The photos that show fishermen at work (of which there are many less
for obvious reasons) show men in grubby, thick, chunky jerseys.

van der Klift-Tellegen seems to have consulted local people in each
area and asked for their recollections and photos. Although this can't
be considered 100% reliable she does seem to avoid falling into the
trap of repeating "mainstream" history and clearly attempted to
discover the history herself from the practitioners (or their nearest
decendents).

VP



  #13  
Old July 12th 07, 10:48 PM posted to rec.crafts.textiles.yarn
Vintage Purls
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Posts: 294
Default Traditional Dutch Fishermen's Sweaters

On Jul 13, 6:59 am, "Aaron Lewis" wrote:
Would you consider the photos onhttp://gansey.blogspot.com/2007_03_01_archive.htmlto look knitted or
felted?


Your gansey looks knitted to me, not felted.

I'm not denying for a second that your jersey is warm but van der
Klift-Tellegen describes the felting process and provides images of
sweaters that look distinctly felted - I'm satisfied from what I can
see that felted sweaters existed. I know what fine knitting is - I do
a lot myself. I know what felting looks like. Why is it impossible
that some fishermen's sweaters were felted?

VP

  #14  
Old July 13th 07, 01:36 AM posted to rec.crafts.textiles.yarn
Aaron Lewis
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Posts: 65
Default Traditional Dutch Fishermen's Sweaters

It is possible. In fact, it would solve the question how Europeans could
have been fishing the Newfoundland banks long before knitting arrived in
Europe.

However, my guess is that felt is not as durable as a gansey knit from
worsted yarn spun from a long staple wool. That is OK if you are a coastal
fisherman. But, if you are far at sea and your upper garment starts to fall
apart, then you will die and your family will starve. I once wore a pair of
wool pants up into the hills. It turned rainy, and after a few days those
pants just disintegrated. I would have froze, if I had not also been
wearing a wonderful old Canadian army officer's wool shirt. While my pants
fell apart, that shirt never even lost its crisp creases. My point is: that
not all wool fabrics have the same durability. So, instead of a fisherman
taking one knit gansey for a season of fishing, he would end up taking 2 or
3 or .?. felted garments. So then he has a larger duffel bag and less space
in his berth. Ever (try to) sleep in a fisherman's berth with your duffel
beside you?

Fishermen slept in their ganseys. I've slept in my gansey. Would a felt
sweater be comfortable enough to sleep in?

I think we need to make up a swatch of felt as directed by Klift-Tellegen
and see how it stands up to flexing and abrasion while being drenched with
salt water for a few weeks. Then, we test to see if the swatch of felt is
as warm as a swatch of gansey material. If the felt has reasonable
durability and warmth, then we make up a felt garment and see how it works.

My guess is that if Klift-Tellegen's felting produced a warmer, more
comfortable, more durable garment than knitting, then we would have seen
more felting and less knitting.

Belfast mills has a really neat felting machine G It can convert a bat of
wool into felt in 15 minutes.

Aaron



"Vintage Purls" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Jul 13, 6:59 am, "Aaron Lewis" wrote:
Would you consider the photos
onhttp://gansey.blogspot.com/2007_03_01_archive.htmlto look knitted or
felted?


Your gansey looks knitted to me, not felted.

I'm not denying for a second that your jersey is warm but van der
Klift-Tellegen describes the felting process and provides images of
sweaters that look distinctly felted - I'm satisfied from what I can
see that felted sweaters existed. I know what fine knitting is - I do
a lot myself. I know what felting looks like. Why is it impossible
that some fishermen's sweaters were felted?

VP



 




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