UK Hallmarking Gripe!

Does anyone on this NG have any opinions about the UK Assay Office and the
minimum charge they impose?
Personally, I am totally against the minimum charge of 16 pounds sterling
(ex. vat) which the Assay Office charges for gold assaying and marking.

In practice you would have to pay 18.80 pounds for hallmarking a ring in
which the gold is worth only 2.50 pounds!

It keeps on going up, and I think it is very unfair on people like me who
usually can't group together a sufficient number of gold items to offset
this charge.
I don't do much gold nowadays, but I occasionally get an order from a shop
for one of my rings for a particular finger size, and of course it has to
go to the assay office.

I recently did a small wedding ring for a client of a retail outlet I
sometimes work with. This ring is a similar model and weight to some rings
on sale for around 24 quid retail in cheaper shops in the UK, except it's
hand made and it's got my name on it. It's about 2.5 grams, 9 carat, and I
charged the shop 20 pounds.
(To be honest I don't know what he charges the customer for my stuff, I
imagine he usually doubles what I charge and adds 17.5% VAT.)

My costs we 9 carat gold, 2.5 grams @ 3pounds per gram = 7.50
Labour approx. 45 mins.@ 15pounds per hour = 11.25
Assay office Min. charge 16pounds+ 2.8pounds VAT =18.80


Total = 37.55pounds

As you can see, I made a loss on this, thanks to the Assay Office!
(I have not even added the 11 pounds of postage and packing to and from the
Assay office)

Although the assay and hallmarking charge for rings is currently a
reasonable 33 pence per ring +VAT, you would have to send in at least 48
rings in one parcel, due to the imposition of this minimum price of 16
pounds per parcel (and per standard i.e. 9ct, 14ct, 18ct, 22ct. )

In the UK the law says an item weighing over 1 gram and sold as gold, has
to be assayed and hallmarked.
At the current gold price, 9 carat ring weighing 1 gram contains gold worth
approx. 2.5 to 3 pounds (or 5 US dollars).
It seems absurd that, in order to protect the public and make sure they get
their 3 poundsworth of gold (instead of perhaps 2 pounds and 95 pence in
the event that it's a bit under carat), the Assay Office demand 16 pounds!
which is 5 or 6 times more than the value of the gold!

The Assay Office might answer that it's not cost effective for them to do
one ring, unless they charge this minimum price. I say if they can't do it
at a reasonable price, let's not oblige makers to have things hallmarked,
let's make it voluntary instead. Or, force the Assay Office to charge a
much lower minimum price, and absorb the cost.

The way things are now, the Assay Office is dictating whether or not many
small makers like me can afford to do certain jobs, because the hallmarking
min.charge is just too much.


Regards,

Terry

Terry wrote:

snip snip....
My costs we 9 carat gold, 2.5 grams @ 3pounds per gram = 7.50
Labour approx. 45 mins.@ 15pounds per hour = 11.25
Assay office Min. charge 16pounds+ 2.8pounds VAT =18.80


Total = 37.55pounds

As you can see, I made a loss on this, thanks to the Assay Office!
(I have not even added the 11 pounds of postage and packing to and from the
Assay office)

Although the assay and hallmarking charge for rings is currently a
reasonable 33 pence per ring +VAT, you would have to send in at least 48
rings in one parcel, due to the imposition of this minimum price of 16
pounds per parcel (and per standard i.e. 9ct, 14ct, 18ct, 22ct. )


What Assay office do you use? I think it must depend on the Assay
office. I use the Birmingham office and the most recent parcel (also for
one ring) was:
minimum charge 10 pounds, initial charge 0.12 pounds - all plus 17.5%
VAT = 11.89 pounds.
Added to this, of course, was the cost of postage and packing both ways,
which added another 11 pounds or so. I charged 20 pounds for the
hallmarking, and so also lost out. Not as much as you, but its still a loss.

The parcel cost is _only_ 2/3 of yours, but I still think its
exorbitant. I also object to the minimum charge being applied to each
standard - I can almost accept the argument that each standard involves
a separate assay process, but they even apply it to platinum where they
use a simple acid test.


--

Regards, Gary Wooding
(To reply by email, change feet to foot in my address)

Terry wrote:
Does anyone on this NG have any opinions about the UK Assay Office and the
minimum charge they impose?
Personally, I am totally against the minimum charge of 16 pounds sterling
(ex. vat) which the Assay Office charges for gold assaying and marking.

In practice you would have to pay 18.80 pounds for hallmarking a ring in
which the gold is worth only 2.50 pounds!

It keeps on going up, and I think it is very unfair on people like me who
usually can't group together a sufficient number of gold items to offset
this charge.
I don't do much gold nowadays, but I occasionally get an order from a shop
for one of my rings for a particular finger size, and of course it has to
go to the assay office.

I recently did a small wedding ring for a client of a retail outlet I
sometimes work with. This ring is a similar model and weight to some rings
on sale for around 24 quid retail in cheaper shops in the UK, except it's
hand made and it's got my name on it. It's about 2.5 grams, 9 carat, and I
charged the shop 20 pounds.
(To be honest I don't know what he charges the customer for my stuff, I
imagine he usually doubles what I charge and adds 17.5% VAT.)

My costs we 9 carat gold, 2.5 grams @ 3pounds per gram = 7.50
Labour approx. 45 mins.@ 15pounds per hour = 11.25
Assay office Min. charge 16pounds+ 2.8pounds VAT =18.80


Total = 37.55pounds

As you can see, I made a loss on this, thanks to the Assay Office!
(I have not even added the 11 pounds of postage and packing to and from the
Assay office)

Although the assay and hallmarking charge for rings is currently a
reasonable 33 pence per ring +VAT, you would have to send in at least 48
rings in one parcel, due to the imposition of this minimum price of 16
pounds per parcel (and per standard i.e. 9ct, 14ct, 18ct, 22ct. )

In the UK the law says an item weighing over 1 gram and sold as gold, has
to be assayed and hallmarked.
At the current gold price, 9 carat ring weighing 1 gram contains gold worth
approx. 2.5 to 3 pounds (or 5 US dollars).
It seems absurd that, in order to protect the public and make sure they get
their 3 poundsworth of gold (instead of perhaps 2 pounds and 95 pence in
the event that it's a bit under carat), the Assay Office demand 16 pounds!
which is 5 or 6 times more than the value of the gold!

The Assay Office might answer that it's not cost effective for them to do
one ring, unless they charge this minimum price. I say if they can't do it
at a reasonable price, let's not oblige makers to have things hallmarked,
let's make it voluntary instead. Or, force the Assay Office to charge a
much lower minimum price, and absorb the cost.

The way things are now, the Assay Office is dictating whether or not many
small makers like me can afford to do certain jobs, because the hallmarking
min.charge is just too much.


Regards,

Terry










So youve some simple choices to make.
you dont do gold or
you sell it as yellow metal to your shop..
Youll still get your time paid for plus your base metal costs.

Or you dont sell to shops,
you do craft fairs
there you meet the retail buyer.
where you make all the profit as a designer, maker and seller.
you then dont need to make as much jewellery to earn the same wage.
you can then say make your 50 simple say 2 wire twist gold rings,
not a days work, selling at £15.00 each,
get them hall marked and seriously undercut the normal shop price.
You cant go wrong going this way.
Ive done this for 35 years and done everything I wanted as a metal
worker.as well as raised a family,
Hope this helps.
the buck stops with you so go for it.
Ted Frater

As a newbie to jewellery, (Pre-newbie even since I have yet to make
something), there are several questions regarding UK hallmarking.

From the web it says all silver items 7.8 gm must be hallmarked if they
are to be referred to as silver. But it is unclear about the following.

1) Does this refer only to the silver in the item? i.e. doesn't include
gems or other material?

2) Does it refer only to the silver in the alloy used?

3) When they say 'referred to', do they mean you can sell bigger silver
items unhallmarked if they are not referred to as silver? Also does
'referred to' mean with 'silver' stamped on the item somewhere or does
it cover printed descriptions of unhallmarked items?
That's not very clear. Let me give example.
Can you sell silver items larger than 7.8gm if they are not hallmarked
and can you otherwise still describe them as being silver?

4) Can you make unhallmarked items for personal use larger than 7.8 gm?


I agree with you Terry BTW, hallmarking is just another stealth tax much
beloved by UK Grabberments. There are trades description acts and sale
of goods acts which give ample recourse to prosecute anyone
shortchanging a customer I would have thought. At least they work for
everything else.


regards
chic





"Terry" wrote in message
...

Does anyone on this NG have any opinions about the UK Assay Office and
the
minimum charge they impose?
Personally, I am totally against the minimum charge of 16 pounds
sterling
(ex. vat) which the Assay Office charges for gold assaying and
marking.

In practice you would have to pay 18.80 pounds for hallmarking a ring
in
which the gold is worth only 2.50 pounds!

It keeps on going up, and I think it is very unfair on people like me
who
usually can't group together a sufficient number of gold items to
offset
this charge.
I don't do much gold nowadays, but I occasionally get an order from a
shop
for one of my rings for a particular finger size, and of course it has
to
go to the assay office.

I recently did a small wedding ring for a client of a retail outlet I
sometimes work with. This ring is a similar model and weight to some
rings
on sale for around 24 quid retail in cheaper shops in the UK, except
it's
hand made and it's got my name on it. It's about 2.5 grams, 9 carat,
and I
charged the shop 20 pounds.
(To be honest I don't know what he charges the customer for my stuff,
I
imagine he usually doubles what I charge and adds 17.5% VAT.)

My costs we 9 carat gold, 2.5 grams @ 3pounds per gram = 7.50
Labour approx. 45 mins.@ 15pounds per hour = 11.25
Assay office Min. charge 16pounds+ 2.8pounds VAT =18.80


Total = 37.55pounds

As you can see, I made a loss on this, thanks to the Assay Office!
(I have not even added the 11 pounds of postage and packing to and
from the
Assay office)

Although the assay and hallmarking charge for rings is currently a
reasonable 33 pence per ring +VAT, you would have to send in at least
48
rings in one parcel, due to the imposition of this minimum price of 16
pounds per parcel (and per standard i.e. 9ct, 14ct, 18ct, 22ct. )

In the UK the law says an item weighing over 1 gram and sold as gold,
has
to be assayed and hallmarked.
At the current gold price, 9 carat ring weighing 1 gram contains gold
worth
approx. 2.5 to 3 pounds (or 5 US dollars).
It seems absurd that, in order to protect the public and make sure
they get
their 3 poundsworth of gold (instead of perhaps 2 pounds and 95 pence
in
the event that it's a bit under carat), the Assay Office demand 16
pounds!
which is 5 or 6 times more than the value of the gold!

The Assay Office might answer that it's not cost effective for them
to do
one ring, unless they charge this minimum price. I say if they can't
do it
at a reasonable price, let's not oblige makers to have things
hallmarked,
let's make it voluntary instead. Or, force the Assay Office to charge
a
much lower minimum price, and absorb the cost.

The way things are now, the Assay Office is dictating whether or not
many
small makers like me can afford to do certain jobs, because the
hallmarking
min.charge is just too much.


Regards,

Terry

Wooding wrote in
:

Terry wrote:

What Assay office do you use? I think it must depend on the Assay
office. I use the Birmingham office and the most recent parcel (also
for one ring) was:
minimum charge 10 pounds, initial charge 0.12 pounds - all plus
17.5%
VAT = 11.89 pounds.
Added to this, of course, was the cost of postage and packing both
ways, which added another 11 pounds or so. I charged 20 pounds for the
hallmarking, and so also lost out. Not as much as you, but its still a
loss.

The parcel cost is _only_ 2/3 of yours, but I still think its
exorbitant. I also object to the minimum charge being applied to each
standard - I can almost accept the argument that each standard
involves a separate assay process, but they even apply it to platinum
where they use a simple acid test.


Gary - Thanks for this info, I didn't realise that they are allowed to
charge different rates.I am registered at Sheffield Assay Office, which is
16 pounds minimum.
I have just phoned the others to check, and London Assay Office minimum
charge is £8.50, nearly half that of Sheffield!

The person I spoke to at Sheffield told me that the Assay Master decides on
the pricing, but didn't give me any other details.

Regards,
Terry

"Chicmac" wrote in
:

As a newbie to jewellery, (Pre-newbie even since I have yet to make
something), there are several questions regarding UK hallmarking.

From the web it says all silver items 7.8 gm must be hallmarked if they
are to be referred to as silver. But it is unclear about the following.

1) Does this refer only to the silver in the item? i.e. doesn't include
gems or other material?

2) Does it refer only to the silver in the alloy used?

3) When they say 'referred to', do they mean you can sell bigger silver
items unhallmarked if they are not referred to as silver? Also does
'referred to' mean with 'silver' stamped on the item somewhere or does
it cover printed descriptions of unhallmarked items?
That's not very clear. Let me give example.
Can you sell silver items larger than 7.8gm if they are not hallmarked
and can you otherwise still describe them as being silver?

4) Can you make unhallmarked items for personal use larger than 7.8 gm?


It's only about selling it, and what you describe it as when you are
selling it.
If the piece is over 7.8 grams and it's not hallmarked, you are not allowed
to sell it IF you describe it as "silver". You can still sell it though,
you must not call it silver, you can call it "white metal".
Same for gold (e.g. in UK shops, sales people are not allowed to describe
their two-tone gold and steel watches as such, even if they are 18 carat,
it has to be called "yellow metal")

Regards,

Terry.

"Chicmac" wrote in message
...
As a newbie to jewellery, (Pre-newbie even since I have yet to make
something), there are several questions regarding UK hallmarking.

From the web it says all silver items 7.8 gm must be hallmarked if they
are to be referred to as silver. But it is unclear about the following.

1) Does this refer only to the silver in the item? i.e. doesn't include
gems or other material?

As a rule you don't send finished stuff to be hallmarked, you set the jems
after hallmarking. The weight is the weight of metal.

2) Does it refer only to the silver in the alloy used?

The metal's weight. It is marked sterling.

3) When they say 'referred to', do they mean you can sell bigger silver
items unhallmarked if they are not referred to as silver?

Technically something over the minimum weight that is not hallmarked is
called 'white metal'.

Some hallmarks, such as those from Holland, are accepted in the UK, some
others, such as Italian, are not.

Also does
'referred to' mean with 'silver' stamped on the item somewhere or does
it cover printed descriptions of unhallmarked items?

Everything sold as 'silver' must be stamped. However you're allowed to
stamp small items yourself, usually with a small stamp marked '.925'

That's not very clear. Let me give example.
Can you sell silver items larger than 7.8gm if they are not hallmarked
and can you otherwise still describe them as being silver?

No

4) Can you make unhallmarked items for personal use larger than 7.8 gm?

Yes.

I agree with you Terry BTW, hallmarking is just another stealth tax much
beloved by UK Grabberments.

Well the system is now about 400 years old and no serious problems with the
system have yet been found.

It is the oldest consumer protection system in the world still running.

I should add that the solution is either to make more things or to send them
via Cookson's who have a reasonabley priced hallmarking service.

If you send enough stuff you should get the price down to about 60p an item.

--
William Black

I've seen things you people wouldn't believe
Barbeques on fire by chalets past the headland
I've watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off Newborough
All this will pass like ice-cream on the beach
Time for tea

Strewth this has opened a whole can of worms!
I am in the samre position as you Terry except I don't do work for
other shops but the minimum charge per quality hurts. Interesting that
it varies by Assay Office though - room for some discussion there
perhaps.
I have noticed that the minimum charge has doubled over the last 6
years or so.
For one offs where it is feasible I have taken to using hallmarked
shanks (Cookson charge about 3 UKP extra) and adding to it, butchering
etc. but that isn't always possible, like the 18white engagement ring
I just cast but I am lucky in that retailing direct I can factor in
the cost of Assaying one item - I try and have some other pieces handy
to include so it saves on postage at least.

The Assay Ofiices are now, I think, completely autonomous and whilst
it feels like a tax I think they are just covering costs plus
investment etc.

Chic's questions:-
1) items submitted for Assay must be complete (pendants have bails,
broches have pins etc.) but NOT gems set or other non-metallic
components.

2) For silver 7.8g refers to the alloy, presumably sterling although
it is still possible to have Britannia silver (958.4) assayed.

3) This boils down to if you call it silver (stamped as such, labelled
or just say it is) and it's over the 7.8 limit it has to be hallmarked
or you break the law. This doesn't apply to private transactions, only
those in the course of a trade or business, but if you make more than
a few in a year then it will be deemed to be a business.
So to be clear
Can you sell silver items larger than 7.8gm if they are not hallmarked
and can you otherwise still describe them as being silver?
No.
If it's over 7.8g and you sell it then it is 'white metal' - how good
does that sound?

If you don't sell it you can do anything you like at any weight.

Despite all this, and the delay involved in sending items to the Assay
Office - I can't visit like some, I staunchly defend our system. It
gives an absolute gaurantee to the customer that the item is what it
purports to be and the recent climb down by the EU who tried to
rationalise our system out of existence was welcomed by me at least.
The stamping of an article by the maker without an independant test
leaves the customer to decide how much they trust the maker, if they
have any idea who that is.
Without hallmarking we would be open to competition from every
fraudster and cheat going who could stamp a mark on any old crap. How
many customers are going to get a private assay done?

I vividly remember getting my punches and stamping my first piece -
still have it and am proud to be part of a system that is several
hundred years old.


Andy Parker, Agate House Lapidary
Ulverston, Cumbria, England

www.agatehouse.co.uk
Tel: 01229 584023

vj found this in rec.crafts.jewelry, from Terry
:

]The person I spoke to at Sheffield told me that the Assay Master decides on
]the pricing, but didn't give me any other details.

now THAT is insane! at the very least, if the requirement is set by
law, and the office is run by the government, the prices should all be
the same!


--
@vicki [SnuggleWench]
(Books) http://www.booksnbytes.com
(Jewelry) http://www.vickijean.com/new.html
(Metalsmithing) http://www.vickijean.com/metalsmithing/index.html
yahooID: vjean95967
-----------
The measure of the menace of a man is not what hardware he carries,
but what ideas he believes. -- Jeff Jordan

Andy Parker wrote:

For one offs where it is feasible I have taken to using hallmarked
shanks (Cookson charge about 3 UKP extra) and adding to it, butchering
etc.


Unfortunately, this is not strictly legal. I have seen reports of
jewellers being prosecuted because they have _repaired_ jewellery by
adding parts and not having the piece re-assayed afterwards.

--

Regards, Gary Wooding
(To reply by email, change feet to foot in my address)