Soldering

"Peter W. Rowe"

For one thing, in electronics, virtually all but the tiniest (surface
mount)
componants use the solder more for the electrical connection, having
established
a pretty decent mechanical connection first. Leads go through circuit
board
holes, and often get bent away from the holes a bit. even without the
bend, the
componants are mechanically held......

This is correct but if the solder fails, you have an unreliable electrical
connection even if the mechanical connection prevents the part from falling
out. And good solder connections rarely fail.

Also, in most
electronics soldering, there is a considerable excess of solder used. the
solder usually forms a mound over the joint......

Good point.

This is mechanically quite different from jewelry soldering where often
one has a thin,
tight, capillary joint between only two small flat surfaces, and one
desires no
solder outside of that seam to show.

Another one. However, in the case of my findings, I can have a large amount
of solder inside that will never show. These have no backings as discussed
earilier which would allow only capilary amounts of solder.

But the main objections to soft soldering are aesthetic.

I think if I keep the solder inside and gold plate the whole when done, it
would satisfy my aesthetic needs at this point in my career.

I am not disputing your very interesting informtaion here which I am
absorbing like a sponge. It's just that I am not ready to deal with red hot
stuff on the bench yet.

I just got my microtorch and soldered a couple of findings to a copper plate
and things did not go well as it is. I finally got one to "solder" properly
and leave (to me) an acceptable aesthetic but what I had to go through to
get there points to more practice and better materials.

I bought the torch from McMaster because of next day delivery but the only
solder paste they had has no silver in it and not fun to work with. I ended
up using a bit of 3% silver solder and some acid flux I have had for 50
years.

I am not sure I understand even this simple process. It seems to take
forever to heat up the copper to get the solder to melt and I have read
where this must be done before heating the finding or the solder. Problem
is knowing when it is hot enough without melting some solder on it to find
out.

Looking at the back side of my practice plate also gives me pause... it
discolored and ugly. Can I assume that the inside of my cup will look like
this or am I just getting things too hot?

Anyway, I am having fun with soft solder and the idea of getting it red hot
to do real soldering is just going to have to wait.

Thanks again,

js


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Jack Schmidling wrote:

In spite of the flack, I have aquired a good deal of useful information here
but I am really hung up on the criticism of soft solder.


Yo Jack,

As others have said before, you ARE deep in over your head.

Lead, which is the main component of soft solders, and precious metals just do
not mix. Period.

This has nothing to do with criticism, as you see it, but rather with your
extreme lack of knowledge, that you are trying to acquire thorugh a newsgroup.
Not going to happen. You may complete yoiur chalice, and you'll still know
nothing. That's why you get "really hung up on the criticism of soft solder".

Be my guest solder you damn chalice with soft solder. Make sure to use a nice
large flame, which you will need to, because silver just so happens to be the
best conductor of heat (as well as electricity) known to man, so it makes for
one enormous heat sink. Without adequate heat even soft solder won't flow where
you want it to.

And see what happens. Just do it, and quit whining.

Or maybe, get the butler to do it.

Abrasha
http://www.abrasha.com

From: "Jack Schmidling"

I bought the torch from McMaster because of next day delivery....

I don't usually respond to my own postings but I forgot to mention the other
reason I bought the microtorch from McMaster.... it was half the price of
the same unit in the Rio Grande catalog.

js

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"Ian Johnson" wrote in message
...
A little off topic... is there a way to remove soft solder? Years ago, I
found a Tiffany bud vase in a junk bin @ an antique store. The vase was in
terrible shape; it looked like a dog chewed on it & someone tried to "fix"
it with soft solder. I've been using a flat graver to get the bulk of the
solder off but was wondering if there's an easier approach.

An electric soldering iron and 'solder wick' available from any
Maplins/Radio Shack.

--
William Black
------------------
Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords
is no basis for a system of government

"Abrasha"

And see what happens. Just do it, and quit whining.

I did it... it's beautiful and you are whining.

Or maybe, get the butler to do it.

That's over his depth. He is polishing it as I type.

Thanks for your help. I never could have accomplished this titanic feat
without all your thoughtful help.

js


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"Abrasha" wrote in message
...
Jack Schmidling wrote:

In spite of the flack, I have aquired a good deal of useful information
here
but I am really hung up on the criticism of soft solder.


Yo Jack,

As others have said before, you ARE deep in over your head.

Lead, which is the main component of soft solders, and precious metals
just do
not mix. Period.


A-HA. Caught you. Reality is exactly the opposite. Lead and precious metals
mix only too well. Which is why Lead solders should NEVER be used with
precious metals. Low melting Lead in contact with high melting precious
metals acts like a solvent in contact with plastic even at a temperature
that would not melt the precious metal. This property is taken advantage of
to extract small quantities of precious metals from large quantities of
ground up ore in fire assay work. Tin also has this property but not to the
same extent as Lead. Add Cadmium, which is often a component of the low-melt
"Silver-bearing soft solders" and you have a disaster waiting to happen.



This has nothing to do with criticism, as you see it, but rather with your
extreme lack of knowledge, that you are trying to acquire thorugh a
newsgroup.
Not going to happen. You may complete yoiur chalice, and you'll still
know
nothing. That's why you get "really hung up on the criticism of soft
solder".

Be my guest solder you damn chalice with soft solder. Make sure to use a
nice
large flame, which you will need to, because silver just so happens to be
the
best conductor of heat (as well as electricity) known to man, so it makes
for
one enormous heat sink. Without adequate heat even soft solder won't flow
where
you want it to.

And see what happens. Just do it, and quit whining.

Or maybe, get the butler to do it.


That would be best.


Abrasha
http://www.abrasha.com

--

Don Thompson

~~~~~~~~

"Don T"

A-HA. Caught you. Reality is exactly the opposite. Lead and precious
metals
mix only too well. Which is why Lead solders should NEVER be used with
precious metals....

Obviously the man is over his depth. The word amalgam applies specifically
to mercury but if you melt lead it will act exactly the same way. Silver
will melt (disolve) into hot lead far below its normal melting temp.

Now about that "extreme lack of knowledge" M. Abrasha? There seems to be a
few holes in your also.

js


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I see you think Abrasha was using the words "don't mix" literally. He was
using those words in their vernacular sense i.e. "Never mix gunpowder with
alcohol" is not meant literally but instead is an expression pertaining to
drunks with guns. He knows full well that my "a-ha" was the preface to a
technicality because Abrasha knows as much about metalsmithing as anyone
here and a hell of a lot more than most. You, however, are coming across as
a sore loser. Get over yourself and maybe learn a thing or three.

--

Don Thompson

~~~~~~~~

"Jack Schmidling" wrote in message
...

"Don T"

A-HA. Caught you. Reality is exactly the opposite. Lead and precious
metals
mix only too well. Which is why Lead solders should NEVER be used with
precious metals....

Obviously the man is over his depth. The word amalgam applies
specifically
to mercury but if you melt lead it will act exactly the same way. Silver
will melt (disolve) into hot lead far below its normal melting temp.

Now about that "extreme lack of knowledge" M. Abrasha? There seems to be
a
few holes in your also.

js


--
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Don T wrote:

I see you think Abrasha was using the words "don't mix" literally. He was
using those words in their vernacular sense i.e. "Never mix gunpowder with
alcohol" is not meant literally but instead is an expression pertaining to
drunks with guns. He knows full well that my "a-ha" was the preface to a
technicality because Abrasha knows as much about metalsmithing as anyone
here and a hell of a lot more than most. You, however, are coming across as
a sore loser. Get over yourself and maybe learn a thing or three.

--

Don Thompson


Thank you, for pointing out what should have been obvious to our resident
millionaire.

Abrasha
http://www.abrasha.com

"Don T"

You, however, are coming across as
a sore loser. Get over yourself and maybe learn a thing or three.

I have learned many things and have stated same several times.

How can I be a sore loser? I came here asking questions. Every answer is a
win.

Fencing with people who have more interest in pointing out how stipid I am
is just a side show.

I might even learn something from said folks if they would show how smart
they are instead of wasting energy on ad hominem attacks and pointing out
the obvious. I would not ask questions if I knew the answers.

I wonder if the expert metalsmiths would be over their heads if faced with a
faceting machine and wanted to cut gems to solder on their masterpieces.

And suppose one of them checked into a faceting list and asked a few
questions?

js


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