OT update on this week's crisis

Anne Rogers wrote:

Unfortunately, in America, we are under-educated about it. In Europe
it is a more recognized and understood condition.

Well, I'm from the UK and I can't honestly say my experience there was
much different, my parents are fairly clueless about depression. The
friend I'm having particular trouble with right now, lived in England
for a long time and a mutual friend there had very servere postpartum
depression. Several mutual friends here have also had issues, so it's
very confusing how harsh she is being right now.

Cheers
Anne

Hi Anne,

I can certainly see why you are confused and perturbed by your old
friend's behavior. I would be too.

I have two thoughts on the subject and neither may be correct, but here
they are anyway.

1. Some people when they feel helpless to help (after all there isn't
much your friend can actually "do" to "fix" your depression) get angry.
Sometimes they blame the victim. It's kind of along the lines of
those who get angry at someone they cared for who had the bad manners to
die. We know that's ludicrous, and yet it still happens.

2. My second thought is that she's gotten some very bad advice from
someone along the lines of "tough love" will force you to cope. That's
ludicrous too, but desperate people often will believe and try anything.

I don't really know if either of these applies to your friend, but I
think the bottom line right now, is that she isn't coping well with your
illness. While it may hurt, you need to stay away from her and
situations involving her. She's toxic to you at the moment.

Hugs,
Michelle in Nevada

I don't really know if either of these applies to your friend, but I
think the bottom line right now, is that she isn't coping well with your
illness. While it may hurt, you need to stay away from her and
situations involving her. She's toxic to you at the moment.

This would be close to impossible and by the same logic my husband is
also toxic to me at the moment as he has been demonstrating similar
behaviours and at time is seems that DH, the friend and the friend's
husband are ganging up against me.

This couple are pretty much surrogate Aunt and Uncle to my kids, we live
on the opposite side of the world to any of our biological family and I
support the relationship they have with them.

It would also mean that I couldn't go to church, which would probably be
a negative thing as that it where most of my other friends are. We've
only lived here almost 3 years and I'm slow to make friends, so alot of
them would fade if I didn't see them at church.

Church this morning was awful, I had asked my husband to always be with
me, and that I wanted to leave straight afer service, but he dawdled and
I ended up needing to feed the baby, meaning I was stuck sitting down
until almost everyone had gone. It was really obvious that everyone at
all in the know avoided talking to me, though I saw many of them go and
offer words of support to my husband. I don't deny that he needs
support, but I need it to. Many have claimed unconditional love for me,
but it's not being demonstrated right now.

Cheers
Anne

I think it is still something most people have heard of but have no idea
of how it manifests itself, so they do not know how to handle it when a
friend or family member is suffering from it. I have a friend who was
hospitalised with it after the birth of each of her two children.
However even having been treated for depression myself in the past I
find it hard to get my mind round it being that severe.

Thankfully in the UK there are several mother and baby units for women
who need inpatient mental health care. They don't seem to exist in the
US, I think if they did, I'd gladly go in right now, though they might
not take me as I'm nowhere near as ill as when I was an inpatient after
my first was born.

Cheers
Anne

Anne, take heart you can get unconditional love here. One of the advantages
of the internet. We don't have to know the whole situation, we just love you
the way you are. Wish I was closer, but here's a cyber hugh.
{{{{Anne}}}}

Take care and best wishes for all.
Marilyn

I'm sure you are doing all that you can but please, please go have your
thyroid checked. Specially ask for a Free T3 and Free T4 test, not just
the regular TSH test.

I was really depressed after baby #7. I knew it wasn't normal for me.
Finally one dr heard me. My T4 is low but the TSH test comes back
normal. Got me on the meds and within two weeks I was well on my way
back to normal. Been on the meds for two years now and it's the best
thing I could have imagined. I also starting gaining weight two days
after having baby so that added to the depression. I could be totally
wrong but for your families sake I hope you get it checked to be sure.

Know that you are not alone in this. As alien as the feelings your
having are you still are you! It sounds like you are doing everything
you can and that is great! Men make illness so much worse sometimes. I'm
pretty sure mine has never seen & certainly doesn't understand sympathy
or empathy at all. If you ever want to talk email me off list. In the
meantime I will keep you all in my prayers.
Take Care
Joanna

Anne Rogers wrote:
Thank you all so much for your kind comments and prayers.

For those of you that weren't clear, I am definitely in treatment for my
depression, I'm on meds, see a psychotherapist and have been recommended
a group therapy that I should join, which starts in October.

One of the problems has been that my husband is the kind of man that
calls a spade a spade, it's not that he doesn't care about my
depression, but he can't really evaluate my mood and probably wouldn't
change how he treated me anyway. I think he is verging on being unable
to see depression as an illness and purely thinks that it's a matter of
fixing problems.

There are a lot of problems that I can work on, but it will be a slow
process, meanwhile, I'm still ill, I'm doing very well, but I'm on a
huge dose of medication, which can sometimes create problems of it's own.

Rather frustratingly, as CPS did assign us a social worker, because he
couldn't see us until today and my psychiatrist doesn't work Fridays,
I'm not supposed to be alone with the kids until he has spoken with her.
Despite her saying to both of us on Wednesday that I'm not a risk to the
kids and that she wouldn't be saying that unless she was 100% confident
of it as professionally, if she was wrong, it would be disasterous for her.

This will make Monday morning challenging, having to get two kids to
schools in opposite directions, then me to an appointment with the
psychiatrist, a task that would usually mean I took one kid and the baby
and DH took the other. Hopefully the necessary phone calls will happen
on Monday and we'll no longer have that hanging over us.

Meanwhile, I'm exhausted, I'm sleeping very badly and the constant round
of meetings is emotionally exhausting, I could see my husband's regret
and disappointment when I said I have to rest this afternoon.

Weather forecast is fantastic for this weekend, so we could really do
with a gentle family activity, but I'm all out of ideas!

Cheers
Anne

Anne Rogers wrote:

I don't really know if either of these applies to your friend, but I
think the bottom line right now, is that she isn't coping well with
your illness. While it may hurt, you need to stay away from her and
situations involving her. She's toxic to you at the moment.

This would be close to impossible and by the same logic my husband is
also toxic to me at the moment as he has been demonstrating similar
behaviours and at time is seems that DH, the friend and the friend's
husband are ganging up against me.

This couple are pretty much surrogate Aunt and Uncle to my kids, we live
on the opposite side of the world to any of our biological family and I
support the relationship they have with them.

It would also mean that I couldn't go to church, which would probably be
a negative thing as that it where most of my other friends are. We've
only lived here almost 3 years and I'm slow to make friends, so alot of
them would fade if I didn't see them at church.

Church this morning was awful, I had asked my husband to always be with
me, and that I wanted to leave straight afer service, but he dawdled and
I ended up needing to feed the baby, meaning I was stuck sitting down
until almost everyone had gone. It was really obvious that everyone at
all in the know avoided talking to me, though I saw many of them go and
offer words of support to my husband. I don't deny that he needs
support, but I need it to. Many have claimed unconditional love for me,
but it's not being demonstrated right now.

Cheers
Anne


Perhaps you should just come right out and ask your husband and friends
if they are blaming you for your illness. It would open the lines of
communication, and point out to them that their behavior is coming
across to you in this way. While I know it's hard to believe, they may
be clueless.

I'm a little bit baffled why this bout of post-partum depression is such
a mystery to them when you suffered it with your first baby. Did anyone
honestly believe that somehow the second baby would be different? I'll
admit my knowledge on the subject is limited, but it has been my
impression that if a woman suffers from post-partum depression once,
it's highly likely it will occur with the next baby.

With your first baby how long did it take before the symptoms abated?

Hang in there!

((((((((Hugs))))))))))
Michelle in Nevada

Perhaps you should just come right out and ask your husband and friends
if they are blaming you for your illness. It would open the lines of
communication, and point out to them that their behavior is coming
across to you in this way. While I know it's hard to believe, they may
be clueless.
I'm not ready to ask that, but in someways, from the friend, though not
my husband, I think I know the answer, I think she does feel that I do
in someway bring it on myself, one of her explainations for this is that
I chose to use midwives not a doctor, even though I eventually needed a
c-section.

I'm a little bit baffled why this bout of post-partum depression is such
a mystery to them when you suffered it with your first baby. Did anyone
honestly believe that somehow the second baby would be different? I'll
admit my knowledge on the subject is limited, but it has been my
impression that if a woman suffers from post-partum depression once,
it's highly likely it will occur with the next baby.

Actually this is my 3rd baby and miraculously I didn't have PPD after my
2nd. This time the depression started in pregnancy, but I suppose it's
possible that I'm getting another attack that is masked somewhat by the
meds I'm already on.

With your first baby how long did it take before the symptoms abated?

It was after Christmas that things started to look up (this baby was
born 4 days before my son's birthday, so time of year is the same), it
was also worse in the fall. Seems silly, but both my son and this baby
have had a really hard time gaining weight, when my middle child had no
problems, I wonder how much that contributes to me feeling a lack of
confidence as a mother.

Cheers
Anne

Joanna wrote:
I'm sure you are doing all that you can but please, please go have your
thyroid checked. Specially ask for a Free T3 and Free T4 test, not just
the regular TSH test.

I was really depressed after baby #7. I knew it wasn't normal for me.
Finally one dr heard me. My T4 is low but the TSH test comes back
normal. Got me on the meds and within two weeks I was well on my way
back to normal. Been on the meds for two years now and it's the best
thing I could have imagined. I also starting gaining weight two days
after having baby so that added to the depression. I could be totally
wrong but for your families sake I hope you get it checked to be sure.

Know that you are not alone in this. As alien as the feelings your
having are you still are you! It sounds like you are doing everything
you can and that is great! Men make illness so much worse sometimes. I'm
pretty sure mine has never seen & certainly doesn't understand sympathy
or empathy at all. If you ever want to talk email me off list. In the
meantime I will keep you all in my prayers.

I will talk to my doctor about this when I see her next week, we did do
some thyroid tests, but I'm not sure which ones.

Cheers
Anne

Lizzy Taylor wrote:
Anne Rogers wrote:

Unfortunately, in America, we are under-educated about it. In Europe
it is a more recognized and understood condition.

Well, I'm from the UK and I can't honestly say my experience there was
much different, my parents are fairly clueless about depression. The
friend I'm having particular trouble with right now, lived in England
for a long time and a mutual friend there had very servere postpartum
depression. Several mutual friends here have also had issues, so it's
very confusing how harsh she is being right now.

I think it is still something most people have heard of but have no idea
of how it manifests itself, so they do not know how to handle it when a
friend or family member is suffering from it. I have a friend who was
hospitalised with it after the birth of each of her two children.
However even having been treated for depression myself in the past I
find it hard to get my mind round it being that severe.

It manifests in different ways with different people, and some families
cope better than others. Usually the family that copes better is one
where someone close has suffered from some form of depression.

Try not to let her pressure into moving forward faster than you are
ready to and if something seems like a big step for you don't let her
belittle it. She obviously really doesn't understand what you are going
through - I don't think anyone who hasn't experienced it really does,
but I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy.

Me neither.

Hugs from over here in the UK - where the sun has finally come out for
several days in a row!

And I missed it!

Lizzy


--
Kate XXXXXX R.C.T.Q Madame Chef des Trolls
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.katedicey.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!

Anne Rogers wrote:

Church this morning was awful, I had asked my husband to always be with
me, and that I wanted to leave straight afer service, but he dawdled and
I ended up needing to feed the baby, meaning I was stuck sitting down
until almost everyone had gone. It was really obvious that everyone at
all in the know avoided talking to me, though I saw many of them go and
offer words of support to my husband. I don't deny that he needs
support, but I need it to. Many have claimed unconditional love for me,
but it's not being demonstrated right now.

They haven't a clue how to behave towards you. It's like bereavement:
no-one knows what to say.

--
Kate XXXXXX R.C.T.Q Madame Chef des Trolls
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.katedicey.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!