Thank you the jewelry group

I joined this group a few month ago. At that time I was new to DIY
jewelry making and looking for help. I got plenty good advice from the
group members. Now I'm doing well.

I want to thank the members of this group.

I do have a question for the group: lately there are fewer and fewer
posts on this group. Are you moving to other sites or groups? I like
this group and hope it will grow.

Lauren
http://jewelrywonder.com/Handcrafted/

On Thu, 14 Oct 2010 09:27:54 -0700, in rec.crafts.jewelry Jessica
wrote:


I do have a question for the group: lately there are fewer and fewer
posts on this group. Are you moving to other sites or groups? I like
this group and hope it will grow.

Not so much moving, but moved.

This group used to be MUCH busier in years past (like ten years ago). But over
the last decade, the Orchid mail list, hosted by the Ganoksin.com web site has
come to pretty much dominate the area of jewelry and jewelry related
discussions. It's by far the most active discussion forum online for people
interested in jewelry, gems, art metal, etc, from professional to hobbyist. That
list currently has well over 10 thousand active subscribers, and gets usually
around 50 new messages per day. I would be surprised if this newsgroup has more
than a dozen or two people who read it on a regular basis at this point.

The big reasons for the move away from this group are that for one, Orchid (has
nothing to do with flowers) is hosted by a web site. People know about the web.
Many newer users of the internet don't even know there IS such a thing as usenet
or newsgroup, much less how to access them. Plus, even knowing that newsgroups
exist, mail lists are easier to access. You subscribe, and they come in email,
which people already have set up. To access a newsgroup, you have to configure
your software to do that, and more than a few people don't know, or won't bother
to do it. Or, alternatively, you access newsgroups via some web service like
Google groups, which isn't ideal. there's a time delay there, it's slow, and
not all types of groups or posts are supported. Plus, for usenet groups,
meaning those that are not specifically unique to Google, there are then extra
steps to jump through to find them, since Google would prefer you read it's
exclusive groups instead of going through them to read the more universal usenet
groups...


Anyway, this group still exists. I still moderate it. But frankly, I've been
doing this for almost 14 years now, and would prefer at this point to find
someone else to moderate the group. Any takers? It seems to serve little
purpose at this point other than being there for those few readers who don't
want to bother with the volume of messages on the Orchid list. So don't expect
this group to grow. It's been doing the opposite for some time now.

Peter Rowe
moderator
rec.crafts.jewelry

On 15/10/2010 3:39 AM, Peter W. Rowe wrote:
Anyway, this group still exists. I still moderate it. But frankly, I've been
doing this for almost 14 years now, and would prefer at this point to find
someone else to moderate the group. Any takers? It seems to serve little
purpose at this point other than being there for those few readers who don't
want to bother with the volume of messages on the Orchid list. So don't expect
this group to grow. It's been doing the opposite for some time now.

Peter Rowe
moderator
rec.crafts.jewelry

I check this list on occasion, and I do appreciate the work you do to
keep the level of spam to zero.

I frequent the Orchid list more, and thank you for the tips with setting
the black star, I sort of know what to do now.



Regards Charles

Everyone was getting along swimmingly in rec.crafts.jewelry on or
about Thu, 14 Oct 2010 09:39:36 -0700 , when Peter W. Rowe
****ed everything up by saying:

On Thu, 14 Oct 2010 09:27:54 -0700, in rec.crafts.jewelry Jessica
wrote:


I do have a question for the group: lately there are fewer and fewer
posts on this group. Are you moving to other sites or groups? I like
this group and hope it will grow.

Not so much moving, but moved.

This group used to be MUCH busier in years past (like ten years ago). But over
the last decade, the Orchid mail list, hosted by the Ganoksin.com web site has
come to pretty much dominate the area of jewelry and jewelry related
discussions. It's by far the most active discussion forum online for people
interested in jewelry, gems, art metal, etc, from professional to hobbyist. That
list currently has well over 10 thousand active subscribers, and gets usually
around 50 new messages per day. I would be surprised if this newsgroup has more
than a dozen or two people who read it on a regular basis at this point.

Some of us read both but as you can see by my time stamps, not too
often.


The big reasons for the move away from this group are that for one, Orchid (has
nothing to do with flowers) is hosted by a web site. People know about the web.
Many newer users of the internet don't even know there IS such a thing as usenet
or newsgroup, much less how to access them. Plus, even knowing that newsgroups
exist, mail lists are easier to access. You subscribe, and they come in email,
which people already have set up. To access a newsgroup, you have to configure
your software to do that, and more than a few people don't know, or won't bother
to do it.

Yeah, only geeks mess with usenet.

Or, alternatively, you access newsgroups via some web service like
Google groups, which isn't ideal. there's a time delay there, it's slow, and
not all types of groups or posts are supported. Plus, for usenet groups,
meaning those that are not specifically unique to Google, there are then extra
steps to jump through to find them, since Google would prefer you read it's
exclusive groups instead of going through them to read the more universal usenet
groups...


Anyway, this group still exists. I still moderate it. But frankly, I've been
doing this for almost 14 years now, and would prefer at this point to find
someone else to moderate the group. Any takers?

Why don't you set it up to moderate itself?
You know, like alt.hackers?

It seems to serve little
purpose at this point other than being there for those few readers who don't
want to bother with the volume of messages on the Orchid list. So don't expect
this group to grow. It's been doing the opposite for some time now.

:-(

Peter Rowe
moderator
rec.crafts.jewelry

noman

On Sun, 16 Jan 2011 17:26:51 -0800, in rec.crafts.jewelry "Goat Boy Baaaaaaa!"
wrote:


Yeah, only geeks mess with usenet.

And even that gets harder, since with windows 7, finding software that will do
it means using software that is more and more outdated.

Why don't you set it up to moderate itself?
You know, like alt.hackers?

To do that, for one thing, would be to assume posters would know how, since for
alt.hackers, last I checked, posters had to know how to bypass the moderation
scheme. That is'nt so much any special setup for the group, as it is a change
in the moderation policy to make such auto-approval allowed. The group as it
is now, along with many other moderated groups, is not hard to bypass if one
knows which headers to modify and how, but most usual jewelry group posters
don't have their email or news readers set up to make this possible. So it's
simple for me, but would pretty much kill any remaining posters ability to post.
The other way to do it, would be to set up a web site based moderation scheme
which could make it self moderating, (usually simply a method to block obvious
spam and not much more) but doing that means someone, like me, would then have
to not only set up the web site and code, but pay for the site as well. I'm not
interested in doing that.

What I AM interested in doing is finding another moderator. I've done it now
for 15 years. Enough already. Either someone who just wants the "honor" of
moderating a mostly dead group, or who could take it and somehow build upon it,
such as linking it to some useful web site. The obvious choice there would be
to see if Hanuman, owner and operator of the Ganoksin web site and orchid list,
would like to also be the moderator of this newsgroup. That sort of
consilidation might make sense if nobody has any major objections. But I've not
yet asked Hanuman if he wants to bother doing it. Given the activity level of
the group, I don't see any big rush.

Peter Rowe
moderator (yawn)
rec.crafts.jewelry

On 1/16/2011 7:37 PM, Peter W. Rowe wrote:


What I AM interested in doing is finding another moderator. I've done it now
for 15 years.

I have been reading newsgroups for over 25 years and this is the only
moderated group I have ever been on and all it does is barf it up by
waiting for the moderator to bless it.

I would much rather wade through garbage then deal with moderation.

Jack



--


Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Fiber, Gems,
Nature, Radio, Sheep, Sausage, Silver

http://schmidling.com

On Sun, 16 Jan 2011 17:37:05 -0800, Peter W. Rowe
wrote:

On Sun, 16 Jan 2011 17:26:51 -0800, in rec.crafts.jewelry "Goat Boy Baaaaaaa!"
wrote:


Yeah, only geeks mess with usenet.

And even that gets harder, since with windows 7, finding software that will do
it means using software that is more and more outdated.

I don't have Windows 7...yet...but this PC is running XP-Pro x64 using
Agent 2.0 and it works.

Why don't you set it up to moderate itself?
You know, like alt.hackers?

To do that, for one thing, would be to assume posters would know how, since for
alt.hackers, last I checked, posters had to know how to bypass the moderation
scheme.

You could just poast instructions in a FAQ every so often or let the
faithful do it.

That is'nt so much any special setup for the group, as it is a change
in the moderation policy to make such auto-approval allowed. The group as it
is now, along with many other moderated groups, is not hard to bypass if one
knows which headers to modify and how, but most usual jewelry group posters
don't have their email or news readers set up to make this possible. So it's
simple for me, but would pretty much kill any remaining posters ability to post.

It's not that difficult with the right software.

The other way to do it, would be to set up a web site based moderation scheme
which could make it self moderating, (usually simply a method to block obvious
spam and not much more) but doing that means someone, like me, would then have
to not only set up the web site and code, but pay for the site as well. I'm not
interested in doing that.

I'll give you space on my server. You'd just have to pay for the
domain name ($20 a year including whois privacy.)
I won't build the site for you but I will give you a FTP.

You could tell people about mail-to-news gateways and have 'em post
via email and read on Google Froups. (But filling in a header is sure
easier)


What I AM interested in doing is finding another moderator. I've done it now
for 15 years. Enough already. Either someone who just wants the "honor" of
moderating a mostly dead group, or who could take it and somehow build upon it,
such as linking it to some useful web site.

That's the thing, man. The future of the internets is http.
This old way is, well, old.

On Tue, 25 Jan 2011 23:26:36 -0800, in rec.crafts.jewelry noman
wrote:


I don't have Windows 7...yet...but this PC is running XP-Pro x64 using
Agent 2.0 and it works.

Yeah, my old dinosour pc running xp pro died. The new one runs win 7, which
doesn't much like the software I used to use. I'm not about to back up to xp
pro on the new machine, since xp pro simply couldn't actually run this new
machine. too much memory, multi core processor, other stuff it simply wasn't
set up to run well.


You could just poast instructions in a FAQ every so often or let the
faithful do it.

what faithful. Who, besides yourself, do you think both reads this group and
would bother to figure out hacking it? Only the spammers, and not many of them,
I think.


It's not that difficult with the right software.

Yeah, I know. I showed you how, remember? but that doesn't mean people are
gonna go buy software just to read a dead newsgroup.


I'll give you space on my server. You'd just have to pay for the
domain name ($20 a year including whois privacy.)
I won't build the site for you but I will give you a FTP.

I actually already have a domain name, not used, but registered. But I'm not a
good enough webmaster / programmer to know how to set up a site to automate the
group. The only software I know that will do it is STUMP, which itself is not
free either, last I checked. And setting it up isn't so simple.


You could tell people about mail-to-news gateways and have 'em post
via email and read on Google Froups. (But filling in a header is sure
easier)

Posting to google groups does not bypass moderation. Those posts sent to Google
still come to me for approval.




That's the thing, man. The future of the internets is http.
This old way is, well, old.

yeah, I know. Like me. Like you too, pal. (oops, sorry. Just me. Not you.
Honest.)

Peter

On 1/16/2011 7:37 PM, Peter W. Rowe wrote:


What I AM interested in doing is finding another moderator. I've done it now
for 15 years.

I have been reading newsgroups for over 25 years and this is the only
moderated group I have ever been on and all it does is barf it up by
waiting for the moderator to bless it.

I would much rather wade through garbage then deal with moderation.

Jack



--


Astronomy, Beer, Cheese, Fiber, Gems,
Nature, Radio, Sheep, Sausage, Silver

http://schmidling.com

On Tue, 25 Jan 2011 23:26:44 -0800, in rec.crafts.jewelry Jack Schmidling
wrote:

On 1/16/2011 7:37 PM, Peter W. Rowe wrote:


What I AM interested in doing is finding another moderator. I've done it now
for 15 years.

I have been reading newsgroups for over 25 years and this is the only
moderated group I have ever been on and all it does is barf it up by
waiting for the moderator to bless it.

barf it up? Love ya too, Jack. Had a bad day, didja? And I'm an atheist,
especially when it comes to any suggestion that I have any ability to bless
anything. The only things I ever do is block spam, and make some modest attempt
to see that posts are at least somewhere within shooting range of what the group
charter (which I did NOT write, readers did) requires. That is what I was
asked to do back in '96, and what I agreed to do. Anything else would make
the whole notion of moderation (which was also NOT my idea) pointless. Anyone
who thinks I've done this out of some sort of power trip simply doesn't know me
at all. I was asked by multiple other readers of the group, when moderation
was being promoted and discussed, if I'd be willing to do the job. In
innocence, not fully understanding what I was signing on to, I agreed. That may
have been dumb, but I've tried since then to abide by my commitment. It's
aggrevating, then, when people have turned me into their enemy because I wasn't
willing to let them willy nilly rewrite the rules into their own private
versions of how they wanted the rules to read. And though I've been willing
enough to take my own time and money to keep the group alive and when
appropriate, willing too to share of my not inconsiderable experience and
knowledge of the field, it's also been a somewhat one sided affair. Not much
thanks coming back this way, nor often any useful information I needed. And
then to get posts like yours calling what I do (not much any more, i admit)
"barfing it up". How the hell do you think that makes me feel, Jack?

By the way, one reason there are so few moderated groups is that it's somewhat
difficult to find volunteers to moderate groups, even when the vast majority of
a group's readership would like a group to become moderated. The difficulty is
simply that most sane folks don't want to have to endure the slings and arrows
of armchair critics (like your above comment) who don't themselves wish to
actually help, but are happy to gripe.


I would much rather wade through garbage then deal with moderation.


OK, so why are you here? Do you somehow feel like you're adding to this group?
Or do you feel you get something from it?

Something, I mean, that you can't get from garbage?

If garbage is better, why did you even check this group to find the message
you've just responded to?

Peter