Newbie - custom Sterling Siler band with image in it? How to do it?

I am trying to make a ring similar to this.

http://www.creedcanada.com/40081-87.html

No I am not to cheap to buy one (I have seen a few people ripped for
that) what I would like to do is place a custom image in the band to
give to my wife.

Does anyone know where I could get a band and how can I seal an image
in it?

Thanks

Greg

wrote in message
...
I am trying to make a ring similar to this.

http://www.creedcanada.com/40081-87.html

No I am not to cheap to buy one (I have seen a few people ripped for
that) what I would like to do is place a custom image in the band to
give to my wife.

Does anyone know where I could get a band and how can I seal an image
in it?

Thanks

Greg

Another newbie here. You can find tons of wax models on eBay. I used a
vendor called k-Wax Jewelry, do a search for wax molds under category
Jewelry & Watches Jewelry Boxes & Supplies Tools, Findings Molds.

No clue how to get the image in there but that is a cool idea. I'll be
watchin this thread.

Take care,

- Ben

On Mar 1, 9:12 pm, "Ben" wrote:
wrote in message

... I am trying to make a ring similar to this.

http://www.creedcanada.com/40081-87.html

No I am not to cheap to buy one (I have seen a few people ripped for
that) what I would like to do is place a custom image in the band to
give to my wife.

Does anyone know where I could get a band and how can I seal an image
in it?

Thanks

Greg

Another newbie here. You can find tons of wax models on eBay. I used a
vendor called k-Wax Jewelry, do a search for wax molds under category
Jewelry & Watches Jewelry Boxes & Supplies Tools, Findings Molds.

No clue how to get the image in there but that is a cool idea. I'll be
watchin this thread.

Take care,

- Ben

Ben,

Thanks for the led.

Cheers
Greg

wrote in message
...
On Mar 1, 9:12 pm, "Ben" wrote:
wrote in message

... I am trying to make a
ring similar to this.

http://www.creedcanada.com/40081-87.html

No I am not to cheap to buy one (I have seen a few people ripped for
that) what I would like to do is place a custom image in the band to
give to my wife.

Does anyone know where I could get a band and how can I seal an image
in it?

Thanks

Greg

Another newbie here. You can find tons of wax models on eBay. I used a
vendor called k-Wax Jewelry, do a search for wax molds under category
Jewelry & Watches Jewelry Boxes & Supplies Tools, Findings Molds.

No clue how to get the image in there but that is a cool idea. I'll be
watchin this thread.

Take care,

- Ben

Ben,

Thanks for the led.

Cheers
Greg


Greg,

Since no one else has replied I wanted to discuss an idea for this I had and
see what you thought. Again, I'm a newbie so consider the source.

What if you used a plain band wax mold and cut out a channel all the way
around the center. Obviously this would require skill to get it
proportional. Then cast in silver. For the image just find a good source
and print on photo paper and cut a strip out to fit the channel with a
razor. Then (and here's the tricky part) use acrylic to fill over the
image, let set and sand/buff it out. Have no idea if this would work or if
the acrylic would ruin the image...but it might.

Still lurking on this thread hoping one of the pros will give us a clue.

- Ben

On Mar 2, 11:39 am, "Ben" wrote:
wrote in message

...





On Mar 1, 9:12 pm, "Ben" wrote:
wrote in message

. ..Iam trying to make a
ring similar to this.

http://www.creedcanada.com/40081-87.html

No I am not to cheap to buy one (I have seen a few people ripped for
that) what I would like to do is place a custom image in the band to
give to my wife.

Does anyone know where I could get a band and how can I seal an image
in it?

Thanks

Greg

Another newbie here. You can find tons of wax models on eBay. I used a
vendor called k-Wax Jewelry, do a search for wax molds under category
Jewelry & Watches Jewelry Boxes & Supplies Tools, Findings Molds.

No clue how to get the image in there but that is a cool idea. I'll be
watchin this thread.

Take care,

- Ben

Ben,

Thanks for the led.

Cheers
Greg

Greg,

Since no one else has replied I wanted to discuss an idea for this I had and
see what you thought. Again, I'm a newbie so consider the source.

What if you used a plain band wax mold and cut out a channel all the way
around the center. Obviously this would require skill to get it
proportional. Then cast in silver. For the image just find a good source
and print on photo paper and cut a strip out to fit the channel with a
razor. Then (and here's the tricky part) use acrylic to fill over the
image, let set and sand/buff it out. Have no idea if this would work or if
the acrylic would ruin the image...but it might.

Still lurking on this thread hoping one of the pros will give us a clue.

- Ben- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Ben,

Yeah I was hoping a Pro might help also.

I contacted a guy here in NY and for $80 he can make a wax, cast it in
silver, polish it up and make a mold.
After that he had no idea how to seal the image either.

For the acrylic, you think if the it's painted on or just place the
hole ring in it to get a smooth finish then sand/buff it off?
I don't see why the acrylic wouldn't work but I'm a rookie to.

On Mar 2, 11:39 am, "Ben" wrote:
wrote in message

...



On Mar 1, 9:12 pm, "Ben" wrote:
wrote in message

. ..Iam trying to make a
ring similar to this.

http://www.creedcanada.com/40081-87.html

No I am not to cheap to buy one (I have seen a few people ripped for
that) what I would like to do is place a custom image in the band to
give to my wife.

Does anyone know where I could get a band and how can I seal an image
in it?

Thanks

Greg

Another newbie here. You can find tons of wax models on eBay. I used a
vendor called k-Wax Jewelry, do a search for wax molds under category
Jewelry & Watches Jewelry Boxes & Supplies Tools, Findings Molds.

No clue how to get the image in there but that is a cool idea. I'll be
watchin this thread.

Take care,

- Ben

Ben,

Thanks for the led.

Cheers
Greg

Greg,

Since no one else has replied I wanted to discuss an idea for this I had and
see what you thought. Again, I'm a newbie so consider the source.

What if you used a plain band wax mold and cut out a channel all the way
around the center. Obviously this would require skill to get it
proportional. Then cast in silver. For the image just find a good source
and print on photo paper and cut a strip out to fit the channel with a
razor. Then (and here's the tricky part) use acrylic to fill over the
image, let set and sand/buff it out. Have no idea if this would work or if
the acrylic would ruin the image...but it might.

Still lurking on this thread hoping one of the pros will give us a clue.

- Ben



Ben,

Thanks, I was hoping a Pro would chime in also.

I found a place here in NYC that will create a wax band, then a
sterling silver plus the mold for about $80. Seem like a fair price to
save my time. They didn't know how to encase the images either.

So I continue looking. I found one post on this site from 3 years ago
and droppped them an email. I'll let you know what I found out.

Cheers
Greg

On Fri, 02 Mar 2007 21:56:32 -0800, in rec.crafts.jewelry
wrote:


Ben,

Yeah I was hoping a Pro might help also.

I contacted a guy here in NY and for $80 he can make a wax, cast it in
silver, polish it up and make a mold.
After that he had no idea how to seal the image either.

For the acrylic, you think if the it's painted on or just place the
hole ring in it to get a smooth finish then sand/buff it off?
I don't see why the acrylic wouldn't work but I'm a rookie to.


first, apologies to the group for the double posting of this message. My
mistake, not the posters.

As to the problem itself, imbedding an image into a resin layer on a silver band
is not actually a common task most jewelers do a lot of. Thus, perhaps, the low
response. But it's not unheard of, nor all that new.

In the 60s and 70s, Stanley Lechtzin, head of the metals/jewelry department at
Tyler School of art, did a number of experimental works with cast acrylic that
incorporated image imbedments. Oppi Untracts first book (I think, might have
been the second, and I'm being lazy and not looking it up) detailed the
production steps of a torque or pendant (forget which) which did that. The
process he used is rather complex, and not suited to this ring, at least not
without a bunch of modification.

Later (mid 70s?) Eleanor Moty, one of his graduate students, did a bunch of
research into the use of photo-etching of metals, adding resins sometimes. Her
work with it became quite well known. That process involves making a
photographic high contrast negative of an image, often using halftone screens,
in much the same way one might prepare an image transparancy in other areas of
graphic arts that might want an image, such as silk screen printing, and others.
The metal is then coated with a photoresist, such as Kodak KPR liquid, which
upon drying, becomes light sensative. It's exposed using a U.V. light source
through that negative, and then developed, which leaves a photo resist on the
metal that can then be immersed in acid to etch the image pattern. After
etching, you can then make whatever you like from the metal. The process is
capable of rather highly detailed images.

Today, there are slightly easier methods of preparing the resist, since the
Kodak KPR resists, though highly detailed and precise, aren't as friendly to
simple easy home workshop methods. One involves a product called PnP Blue. This
is a sheet of plastic film material. You use a photo copier or a laser printer
to print your desired image (either copied from whatever, or perhaps something
you deveoped on the computer with graphics software) onto the film. the film is
then ironed onto the metal with an ordinary home clothes iron, or some other
similar heat source. When you peel it away, only the parts printed black by the
printer remain stuck to the metal (the black toner is the adhesive), and that
remaining adhered on film is then capable of serving as an acid resist for
etching. Popular stuff for making printed circuits. Again, you're left with
flat sheet metal which you can use to make whatever you wish.

Note that these products give you flat sheet metal. You'd then have to
fabricate your desired band from that sheet. Easy to do silversmithing, you'd
cut a strip to the needed length, bend it around into a flat band and solder the
seam, being careful not to flow solder into the etched pattern, though there
would have to be at least a small area left blank for the seam. Then use wire,
perhaps square wire, bent around to form two bands that snugly fit over the flat
band. positioned right, these become your raised edges. They too get soldered
on.

Now you've got a band with a recessed channel that carries an etched image. You
could oxidize that image for black/metallic contrast, and either leave it as is,
or cover it with a transparent resin, or if you're skilled, a proper enamel.

Etching a design into an already cast band, of the type you've been suggesting,
is not really feasalbe. I suppose someone could figure out a way, but this
would be not trivial, and not beginner level metal working.

If you're intent on casting this, another method would be to take your image and
send it to a graphic arts company that produces the type of etched magnesium or
zinc etched plates that used to be used for printing. Some fine arts printers
still use this, and there are graphic arts companies that will still supply the
etched plates. Only in zinc or more commonly, magnesium, though, not silver.
However, the depth of etch they produce, and the quality of detail is excellent.
And the metal they give you is thick enough to be just fine for a fairly heavy
band ring. So you shape the magnesium or zinc plate as though it were silver to
make your band. Add edges too, in whatever type of wire you wish. Don't solder
joints. Just make things fit snug so they hold together. Now you can have a
rubber mold made of this model. The result will be a mold that can be used to
produce multiples of your band with the etched design reproduced in the wax.
Cast as many of these as you desire. Add a resin filling if you wish.

Another more direct way to do this would be via CAD/CAM. An image converted to
a coarse halftone could be incorporated into a CAD model of a band ring on the
computer, and with that file, a wax model incorporating the image in low relief,
either cut down into the metal or raised up from it, could be machined on a CAM
milling machine. There are machines out there now designed for wax model
production that can do very detailed machining this way. Whether it's enough
detail for your image depends on your image. There are limits. But it's
amazing what's now possible. In your case, best would be to design the thing on
paper, then contract with a jewelry CAD/CAM service bureau to produce the model.
Probably the cost for that would run, I'd guess, between one and two hundred
dollars. Maybe more, depending on just how much time was involved in doing the
CAD work. If you can supply your own CAD file, you can get the model machined
for as little as fifty bucks if you research it. One thing this technology can
do that the others in this message can't, is the raised positive relief image as
opposed to an etched in image. The result might be very similar to the type of
modelling you see in things like class rings. The resulting model is then cast
in your choise of precious metals. Molds can also be made if you want
multiples.

With all that said, though, the ring in your original picture doesn't look like
a photo etched or relief carved design in the metal. it looks more like a plain
old printed image.

The poster who suggested simply gluing in a printed paper image, either custom
printed by you on the computer, or cut from a magazine, or whatever, then
covering with resin, is probably on the right track to duplicate what you saw.
That ring, if it's mass produced, probably is an image directly screen printed
on the metal, then covered with resin, but that gets complex to do. The paper
print affixed to the ring is probably a better way. If you print your own, I'd
suggest perhaps using something like a tyvek paper, made from a tough plastic
fiber. It's the stuff they make those envelopes that you can't tear open from.
It might hold up better than paper, though I don't really know, just guessing.
Regular paper, especially if thin, would let the resin soak all the way through
it, which likely would be just as good as tyvek. Dunno. just a thought.

The resin you might consider might be something like Ceramit, a line of
polyester resins formulated to cure to a quite hard state almost like glass
enamels. The stuff is made for jewelry use. I'd use a thin layer of the clear
first on the band, using it to glue in the paper, and covered over with another
thin layer. Or Just soak the paper in it and lay that into the band. Cure that
first, getting the image in place. Then add several more layers, perhaps with
transparent color if you like. An inlay on a curved band like that is best done
with several thin applications of the resin, not trying to fill the whole thing
in one go. It's best if you don't try to sand and polish it, but leave it with
the gloss finish you get when it cures, so the thin multiple layers give you
much more control that way. You can special order a non standard hardener
resin that is a bit more viscous, better for this type of curved surface. Curing
is done at low temps, around 150 to 200 F usually, though it slowly cures also
at room temp. A toaster oven works fine. You can get the ceramit resin from
many online suppliers of jewelry supplies. Another resin family, based on epoxy
chemisty, and called "colorit" resins, is slightly easier to use, and available
from Rio Grande, but personally I don't like the results as well as the colorit,
which is a harder surface for one thing, and I think somewhat more brilliant
colors. Just my opinion. Others may disagree.

Hope that helps.

Peter Rowe

On Thu, 01 Mar 2007 02:08:20 GMT in rec.crafts.jewelry
, intended to write something intelligible, but
instead wrote :

I am trying to make a ring similar to this.

http://www.creedcanada.com/40081-87.html

No I am not to cheap to buy one (I have seen a few people ripped for
that) what I would like to do is place a custom image in the band to
give to my wife.

Does anyone know where I could get a band and how can I seal an image
in it?

Thanks

Greg

I wrote to the company.




----- Original Message -----
From: Frosty
To:
Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2007 11:53 PM
Subject: Sterling Silver Rose theme ring.

I'm curious about these European rings.
Do you do any custom work?
Can you tell me how you put the pictures into the rings?
I am a jeweler and a customer asked me to copy your design using his
photo.
I'm not comfortable stealing other artists designs and would buy one
from you at retail just to make my customer happy.
But of course if you want to share your techniques with me I would
barter with you if you desire.

http://www.creedcanada.com/rings.html

Their reply:

From: CREED
Subject: Sterling Silver Rose theme ring.


These rings are copyrighted worldwide by our factory in Germany. You
may purchase from us any that you see on our website.


Creed Canada

On Mar 3, 2:50 pm, Frosty wrote:
On Thu, 01 Mar 2007 02:08:20 GMT in rec.crafts.jewelry
, intended to write something intelligible, but
instead wrote :

I am trying to make a ring similar to this.

http://www.creedcanada.com/40081-87.html

No I am not to cheap to buy one (I have seen a few people ripped for
that) what I would like to do is place a custom image in the band to
give to my wife.

Does anyone know where I could get a band and how can I seal an image
in it?

Thanks

Greg

I wrote to the company.

----- Original Message -----
From: Frosty
To:
Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2007 11:53 PM
Subject: Sterling Silver Rose theme ring.

I'm curious about these European rings.
Do you do any custom work?
Can you tell me how you put the pictures into the rings?
I am a jeweler and a customer asked me to copy your design using his
photo.
I'm not comfortable stealing other artists designs and would buy one
from you at retail just to make my customer happy.
But of course if you want to share your techniques with me I would
barter with you if you desire.

http://www.creedcanada.com/rings.html

Their reply:

From: CREED
Subject: Sterling Silver Rose theme ring.

These rings are copyrighted worldwide by our factory in Germany. You
may purchase from us any that you see on our website.

Creed Canada



Firstly, Peter, thanks for all the detail and time you placed into
your response.
I am going to try using an image on differnet paper types and find out
which works best. Also as you suggested I will try the "color it" and
put in on in layers and see how it all works out.

For anyone interested I will post down the road how it works out.

Frosty, nice try sending the email direct....I was hoping they would
do custom work also, but that would of been way to easy...

Thanks to all for the help, it's truly appreciated..
Greg

I would get the ring made as you suggest and then talk to a good
polymere clay person. They have lots of ways of transfering the image
to the clay. I think that you would ultimately be more satisfied with
that than a peice of paper embedded in resin.

GLO